Punch Drunk Hangover 08.25.08: It's a Smash-Mouth Sport
Posted by Bren Oliver on 08.25.2008
Read ahead for Bren Oliver's thoughts on Lesnar vs. Kongo, Affliction's newest signings, Georges St. Pierre vs. BJ Penn II being made official, a confusing move by Strikeforce in relation to Josh Thomson, and Florian's insinuation Huerta may have "greased" up. Those things and more, plus this week's supersized "Monday Morning Moment of Zen" featuring Carano, "Rampage", and Aleks Emelianenko are all just a click away!
Good morning, afternoon, evening, or whatever in-between time your eyes have found their way to the Punch Drunk Hangover! As is the case most Mondays, I'm here with another one-stop shop for catching up on Mixed Martial Arts news, hoping as always to help you escape from the doldroms of an average Monday like a good pinch to the nipples, waking you up and making your day that much more exciting! Have no fear...the technique is Georges St. Pierre approved!!!
After taking a week off for the betterment of my money-league fantasy football team, and my fingers after a three-column week, I've returned to the pages of 411Mania and I'm ready to get back to dishing opinion on all the goings-on in MMA. Speaking of the sport second-most dearest to my heart, though only by a Phelpsian 0.01 increment, it's the time of year once again where football coaches are firing up their teams for the season and fans are firing up their grills for a little parking lot tailgating; where folks are icing down their coolers and thumbing through statistical guides in hopes of finding the next big sleeper. Since there were no stories this week either jumping out in their monumental nature, I thought it might be fun to blend the gridiron with the steel-cage and compile a "fantasy" roster of Mixed Martial Artists in the spirit of football. Though the dance is different, each is a ballet of violence both brutal in its physicality and contingent on athleticism, heart, dedication, and strategy. Success in either endeavor is generally a result of the six inches in front of a player's face. So, in the spirit of football and Mixed Martial Arts, I present, my "2008 MMA All-Pro Team" with a little scouting report on each individual selection...
QB:Randy Couture - A veteran presence ripe with leadership ability / multiple championships / intelligent and technically sound RB:Georges St. Pierre - Tremendously athletic / Fast / Strong / A "franchise" player FB:Jon Fitch - Hard-working / Fearless / Selfless WR:Anderson Silva - Long limbs / Over six-feet tall / Great coordination / Quick / Flashy WR:Wanderlei Silva - Athletic / Seasoned / Not afraid to go over the middle and take a hit TE:"Minotauro" Nogueira - Can take a hit, can dish out a hit / Enough athletic ability to bring in a tough grab when needed K:Fedor Emelianenko - Calm under pressure / Clutch / Foreign! DL:Brock Lesnar - Likes to mix it up physically / Nasty attitude / Strong, yet very agile LB:BJ Penn - Not the biggest on the team, but naturally gifted / Can play every snap, as he's never injured / Great intensity / Well-rounded with a great understanding of the sport DB:Forrest Griffin - Tall / Fast for his frame / Never quits / Can "jaw" with the best of them DB:Lyoto Machida - Good height / Intelligent player / Also KR ability due to elusiveness KR:Kalib Starnes - Great runner in the open field / Speedy / Hard to hit
There's my three cents - now time to give my spin on a handful of other subjects gracing the headlines this past week. I'd love to hear your thoughts on things, or check out your "MMA All-Pro Team" so feel free to shoot me an email or leave a comment at the bottom of the page.
The following medley of items were reported between August 18th, 2008 and August 24th, 2008:
Ozzy Osbourne will be performing at the 10/11 Affliction show in Las Vegas.
Bringing in "The Prince of Darkness" is definitely a step up from Megadeath, though I still feel putting any significant amount of money into a live musical act at a Mixed Martial Arts event is a waste of resources. Affliction is not in a position to burn greenbacks, especially with a weaker overall card at "Day of Reckoning" than the star-studded lineup they presented for "Banned". Beyond the financial aspect, while inserting breaks for the band to play was not universally panned by MMA fans, the voices of discontent were louder than those calling for more live music mixed in with their combat sports. If Tom Atencio's group is so bent on blending the two forms of entertainment, why not go the WWE route and give each PPV an official theme song? The selected band could perform it during the opening introductions where each fighter steps from behind the curtain (as they did at "Banned"), then disappear into the night or settle into a few ringside seats for promotional sake. It would maintain Affliction's desire to have a live act at the show without taking as much focus off the individuals competing on the card or risk of newer fans being turned off by the non-MMA action.
As far as Ozzy goes, I'm certain he'll rock the Thomas and Mack Center in Las Vegas, and I have to admit the idea of Josh Barnett coming out to "Crazy Train" or "Iron Man" is rather appealing. I simply wish the money they're paying him to play either song was invested in "Day of Reckoning" being a successful fight card as opposed to a multimedia event.
MMAWeekly.com is reporting that a Lightweight fight between Kenny Florian and Joe Stevenson could go down on November 15 at UFC 91.
It's a nice pairing of two talented Lightweights, and not necessarily an easy fight to pick a winner of, but I feel Florian will be making a mistake and taking an unnecessary gamble if he steps into the Octagon against Joe Stevenson. Florian is sitting on the cusp of top contendership for the UFC Lightweight Championship, and yes, a win over Stevenson will almost certainly solidify he's "got next". However, losing to the TUF 2 Champion would leave "Ken-Flo" in a tricky position, as he would've dropped a bout to someone who current Lightweight Champion BJ Penn left bloodied and battered at UFC 80. The better option for Florian would be either waiting for the winner of Sherk/Griffin, possibly for a late December clash, or finding a way to get in the cage against Frank Edgar or Gray Maynard. Edgar owns the lone loss on Tyson Griffin's record and happens to share Griffin's distinction of a single career defeat. Maynard, on the other hand, happens to have handed Edgar the smudge on his record, smothering him for three rounds en route to a unanimous decision victory. "The Bully" is undefeated and, as chance would have it, is often a training partner of BJ Penn. With Penn being unavailable until mid-2009 due to a scheduled fight against UFC Welterweight Champion Georges St. Pierre, I truly feel UFC executives missed the mark on what's best for Ken Florian (and the Lightweight contendership picture) when Joe Silva and crew tend to generally be
"Robin Hood and his Merry Men" when it comes to hitting bullseyes.
Again, it's no knock on Stevenson, as he is a brilliant young fighter who has yet to reach his full potential, and I expect him to have a better showing against Florian than Roger Huerta did. He's a more cerebral, and less emotional, fighter than Huerta, and I doubt he'll get as frustrated by Ken's elusive style. It still doesn't mean, in the big picture, he's the best opponent for Florian at this point in the Boston-area Lightweight's career.
EliteXC Heavyweight Champion Antonio Silva Jr. tested positive for Boldenone in his drug test from the last EliteXC show. He has been fined $2500 and suspended for one year.
Frankly, I am shocked that the CSAC is once again mired in controversy related to the results of drug testing! And, if you believe that, I have some property for sale in the Nevada desert with soil so rich you can grow watermelons the size of Tito Ortiz's head! It will be interesting to see how Antonio Silva's appeal goes, as his camp may have a valid claim in regards to Silva's medical condition would be affected by the use of Boldenone. If the combination was, as his manager states, potentially fatal, it would seem to lend creedence to his fighter's innocence (or at least a shadow of doubt where the results are concerned). I suspect "Bigfoot" will file his appeal, have the suspension reduced to six months, and have a chance to defend his EliteXC Heavyweight Championship against one opponent before the organization folds, shortly followed by an individual's maniacal laughter echoing throughout the streets of Las Vegas.
UFC has contacted Cheick Kongo about fighting Brock Lesnar in November or December.
It's appearing as though Kongo vs. Lesnar should be taking place in November at UFC 91, along with Florian vs. Stevenson, and I know at least one 411Mania MMA Writer is ready to get his Octgon-on when Zuffa rolls into Portland. The region has deserved to host a UFC card for some time, as the Pacific Northwest is widely known as one of the hot beds of MMA, and, in particular, I expect fans in the area to appreciate the main event due to Lesnar's background in amateur wrestling. After all, let's not forget Team Quest's association with athletes like Couture, Lindland, and Henderson who collectively compiled incredible collegiate and Olympic careers in the mat-based sport, as well as the training facility's roots in Oregon.
I honestly don't expect Kongo to put up much of a challenge for Lesnar. Brock is stronger, weighs more, and has perhaps the best wrestling of any Heavyweight in Mixed Martial Arts. The Minnesotan took Heath Herring down at will, making him pay for fifteen solid minutes, and Herring had no problem bringing Kongo down to the canvas when the two fought at UFC 82. The only edge I give the ripped Frenchman is in his diversity of striking, as Lesnar throws ham-like fists with bad intention while Cheick is more prone to serve up a kick or two. Still, style ain't substance, and I see too many ways for Brock to win for him not to emerge victorious (and probably a win away from getting a UFC title-shot).
MMAJunkie.com is reporting that EliteXC Welterweight Champion Jake Shields will defend his title against Paul Daley at EliteXC's next CBS show on October 4. The event takes place at the BankAtlantic Center in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. Shields is coming off a huge win against Nick Thompson and is currently on a 10-fight win streak. Daley has a pro record of 18-6-2 and is on a 6-fight win streak.
Paul Daley is a good fighter, and he's riding a very nice win streak including TKO victories over Duane Ludwig and Sam Morgan, but I'm not certain he's at Jake Shields' level, nor am I sure it's smart to give a championship opportunity to a guy who claimed to be retired a few months ago. However, I understand EliteXC's 170-pound ranks are thin, and I'm not sure they had too many options for Shields in terms of high quality opponents. Look at any "Top 10" list and 80% of the Welterweights will likely be under Zuffa contract. The only other person who might have made sense, and who I see as potentially being Shields' next in-ring adversary, is Phil Baroni. His record is barely .500, but he's riding a two-fight streak in his newfound home at Welterweight, and he definitely knows how to sell a match even when he's not donning a bedazzled smoking jacket.
Dana White has confirmed to Kevin Iole of Yahoo! Sports that UFC's annual Super Bowl weekend show will go down on January 31 in Las Vegas, Nevada. He also mentioned that the main event will feature Georges St. Pierre facing BJ Penn. The UFC has 2 shows planned for Las Vegas at the end of the year and one in early 2009. The Ultimate Fighter Finale will go down on December 13, UFC 92 is set for December 27, and of course, the Super Bowl weekend show on January 31.
I stand firm in my belief it is a shame BJ Penn is cutting in line and being given a "Proceed Directly to Welterweight Championship Fight" card. It has nothing to do with how excellent I know Penn vs. St. Pierre II will be. They're each among the "Top 5" pound-for-pound fighters in Mixed Martial Arts. Their first bout was hard fought and came at a time when BJ didn't take training as seriously as he does now. That being said, men like Thiago Alves and Josh Koshceck...even Carlos Condit...have done more than BJ Penn to earn the right, the privilege, to potentially hoist up the UFC Welterweight strap. It may be getting old to hear, sometimes a burden of factual information when people refuse to view things objectively, but Penn is 0-2 in his last two Welterweight fights and has yet to beat a who's-who of the 155-pound class. He took apart an aged Jens Pulver, who was coming off a loss to Joe Lauzon and a nine-month layoff and who promptly dropped to Featherweight. Penn then beat down a title-fight, PPV-main-event debuting Joe Stevenson, and he outclassed Sean Sherk who was coming off a ten-month absence from competition. Stevenson and Sherk are both good fighters, but I would be lying if I said I felt either was at the top of their game against BJ when each locked horns with him. And, if Penn vs. St. Pierre II is indeed for Georges' gold, beyond whether or not Baby Jay deserves his bottle, it also messes with the future of both belts where title defenses are concerned.
My hope is that Dana White uses his devious mind to come up with some sort of catch-weight "interim" championship - for example, a "Super Lightweight" belt with a range of 165-168 pounds. It would allow Penn and St. Pierre to compete for five rounds, if necessary, without interfering with either man's current status as Lightweight/Welterweight champion. It's essentially what the UFC did with St. Pierre and Hughes when Serra was injured, as well as Nogueira and Sylvia based on Couture's ongoing legal situation, so there's no reason the same paper title can't be created for the sake of an epic champ vs. champ showdown. The actual belt can then be "retired", with the winner keeping it as a trophy, and a precedent can be set for similar clashes in the future between champions from different weight classes.
Sherdog.com has confirmed that former IFL standout Chris Horodecki (12-1) will face Dan Lauzon (10-2) at Affliction's "Day Of Reckoning" PPV currently set for October 11 at the Thomas & Mack Center in Las Vegas, Nevada. Former IFL welterweight champion Jay Heiron (15-4) has also verbally agreed to face Drew Fickett (35-6) at Affliction's "Day Of Reckoning" PPV set for October 11 at the Thomas & Mack Center in Las Vegas, Nevada. Fickett is coming off a submission victory over Joe Manzello for Silver Crown Fights back on August 8. Heiron is currently on a 3-fight win streak and hasn't fought since the IFL basically shut its doors. Heiron was fielding offers from UFC, EliteXC, and Strikeforce but ended up signing a 3-fight non-exclusive one-year deal with Affliction last week. It's still unknown if the fights will be on the preliminary card or if they will appear on the PPV, headlined by Andrei Arlovski vs. Josh Barnett.
I have no problem with either of these fights, as both offer something entertaining and involve relatively skilled fighters of comparable levels. Horodecki and Lauzon are two of MMA's youngest competitors of note, with the 20-year old Lauzon actually being unable to legally buy a drink or gamble in a casino even though the Affliction card will be taking place in Las Vegas. Horodecki may be harder hitting than Massachusetts' native, but I'd wager Lauzon's jiujitsu is a bit better and I see him as being more of a technical fighter than Horodecki. It makes for a nice pairing with each standing to benefit from a win over the other. Assuming "Affliction" has a third show, look for the winner of this fight to face "Banned"-victor Mark Hominick, as the Lightweight ranks are fairly slim outside of cross-promoting with EliteXC, Strikeforce, DREAM, or World Victory Road.
Hieron and Fickett are quite a bit more experienced than either aforementioned Lightweight, and I expect an all-out war when the two men who rarely shy away from trash-talk step into the ring this October 11th. Fickett has become a genuine "heel" in Mixed Martial Arts over the past few months due to his shenanigans that ultimately cost him title-shots in both EliteXC (against Jake Shields) and EFC (against Ryan Ford). For those who didn't already know, Fickett essentially booked himself at other events, even fighting at one, without informing either promotion he'd already signed to compete for. However, as many screws as he may have loose on a personal level, Drew Fickett is one of the most underrated 36-5 fighters you'll ever encounter, who in fact can claim career wins over Kurt Pellegrino, Dennis Hallman, Josh Neer, Josh Koscheck, and Ken Florian. He will never be a UFC Champion, but he is well-rounded with the ability to find success on his feet, in the clinch, or by way of submission. Jay Hieron is also a virtual buffet when it comes to what he brings as a Mixed Martial Artist. Hieron is a good striker, has solid wrestling, and also knows a thing or two about tapping people out. Neither is "Top 10" by any stretch of the imagination, but I would say Hieron and Fickett are both somewhere in the 10-15 folks below the elite, a.k.a. UFC, Welterweights, and as they say, styles make fights. That being the case, expect a good one when Fickett and Hieron make their Affliction debuts.
Sherdog.com is reporting that Strikeforce lightweight champion Josh Thomson will face Ashe Bowman at the "Strikeforce At The Mansion II" show which goes down September 20 at the Playboy Mansion. The fight will not be for Thomson's title, but will instead be a regular three-round fight. Thomson is currently on a seven-fight win streak with his last loss coming to Clay Guida back in 2006. Bowman is currently on a three-fight win streak and will be making his Strikeforce debut at the show. He is also a product of Ken Shamrock's "Lion's Den".
I am at a loss as to why Josh Thomson is competing as a Lightweight in a non-title bout. Sure, I understand Strikeforce wants to book talented fighters on their second venture into the land o' the Grotto, but at what cost to the company's standing as legitimate competition to, if not the UFC, the WEC? Thomson will be highly favored over Bowman, and for good reason, but fights are fights; they are unscripted and thereby upredictable. If "Punk" were to somehow end up on the losing end of a decision, or worse, it would tarnish the Strikeforce Lightweight Championship simply because its possessor had been defeated in his last bout. It's something PRIDE often did with their posterboys, though I think it ultimately hurt their championships' credibility in the eyes of many fans. And, even if Thomson wins (as he should), he'll have defeated inferior competition which won't say anything about his standing as a Mixed Martial Artist or world-title holder.
Jibber-Jabber:
The following soundbyte was delivered over the past week...
EliteXC Vice President Gary Shaw on the Noons vs. Diaz II saga...
"KJ Noons versus Nick Diaz is definitely not happening on Oct. 4. I still believe KJ Noons can defend his title, I still believe KJ Noons is a man of honor. He comes from a great family, a fighting family. He's a great kid. He's a great athlete. I think he's just being mismanaged right now. [Negotiating] is the manager's fiduciary responsibility for the fighter. But it's also the manager's responsibility to get his fighter to take the right fights that lead him to financial gains, and it's up to the manager to make sure that he has the fighter understand how EliteXC feels about him. Otherwise the manager is painting whatever picture he wants to paint. And in this case, this manager -- his 15 minutes of fame is costing his client his career.
To be honest, at this point, I would have no problem with EliteXC stripping KJ Noons of his championship due to insubordination and releasing him from his contract. And, in further personal disclosure, I'm starting to be a bit suspicious that's exactly what Noons' camp wants. With recent news about EliteXC being $55 million in debt, and the ratings drop from the first CBS show to the second, his group may feel his future will be better served by competing outside ProElite. It's hard to argue against the notion too when you consider the emphasis on Lightweights in both the UFC and Japan. Noons is a very marketable fighter who may be trying to maximize his potential, and in truth, that can't be done in EliteXC without an upswing in the company's outlook.
Cheick Kongo discusses his potential strategy against Brock Lesnar...
"Just invite him for dinner. *laughs* I won't tell you what would be my strategy! Why would I tell you that? My next opponent would know what to look out for! You know, I try to never underestimate any of my opponents but there's really nothing that worries me too much with Brock Lesnar. I know it could be a tough fight, but, you know, I train hard and I will be ready for this one too. I am hungry."
I believe "King Kong" may have said something similar, in gorilla-based grunts of course, during his ascension up the Empire State Building - "...there's really nothing that worries me too much with bi-planes and machine guns." Sure, Kongo may swat Lesnar a few times, but he's ultimately very likely to get bloodied by Brock's firepower and slammed to the ground (at least once) before the night is through.
And, as it turns out, Lesnar was in fact invited to dinner. His reservation is set for November 15th in Portland, Oregon at UFC 91. When the waiter shows up to take Brock's order, inquiring as to what the former NCAA Champion plans to feast on, Lesnar will have two words for him - "Cheick, please."
Ken Florian talks to "The Fight Card Radio Show" about Roger Huerta's slick strategy at UFC 87...
"To be honest he was really slippery, and I don't mean that like technically-wise he was really slippery. I don't know...I don't want to speculate and say that something was used or whatever, but he was just hard to hang on to, and that was from all the positions. Even when I had him in like a headlock or a guillotine everything was just really slippery. When I get the position, when I get mount, when I get back-mount, I've fought and I've wrestled some of the best guys on the ground from Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and submission wrestling to MMA, and when I get those positions you're not getting out, and Roger was able to get out. It was pretty slippery so I was a little surprised.
Just the first time I was mounted on him and he gave his back I was a little suspicious, I knew something was up. Who knows, all I know is I'm good at keeping those positions and I know the difference between sweat and something else and it felt like something else but who knows. Maybe it's Albolene left over from the day before from the weight cut?"
Somewhere in here there's a tasteless joke about Mexican food being greasy, but I believe I'll avoid taking such a route and instead focus on Florian's insinuation Roger Huerta used a substance to make it more difficult to grab hold of him. I personally think it was extra sweat from all those laborious Superman-punch-to-kick combinations he brought out against "Ken-Flo". Then again, as UFC Ring Girl Arianny Celeste has recently been quoted as saying she and suspected-snugglebunny Roger Huerta are no longer on speaking terms, "El Matador" may have been sweating for other reasons. Has anyone seen "That 70s Show" recently? That Laura Prepon is a real looker! But, I digress. Anyways, I'm certain this isn't the last we'll hear of this situation, as I'm positive Roger Huerta will be firing back some sort of response at Florian and rightfully so. Accusing an opponent of "greasing" is serious business and akin to calling someone a cheater. Just ask Yoshishiro Akiyama or any fan in Japan.
Of course, given how slick Florian looked at UFC 87, Huerta may be the one asking for officials to check into the matter. That being said, I hear talent and a great gameplan make for fine lubricants.
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That's about all she wrote for this week's Hangover. Till next time Punch Drunk buckaroos, here's your triple-shot of "Monday Morning Moment of Zen" to make up for last week's absence - Aleksander Emelianenko beating up Koreans on some bizarre gameshow, "Rampage" dancing as only "Rampage" can, and Gina Carano uttering the words, "I'd have sex all day." Yes, I am mentally ill.
I approve of American television stealing this concept...
Could we have ourselves a future "Dancing with the Stars" contestant?
Please ignore the first 46 seconds of Gina's answer to how she'd spend her last day on Earth...
My MMA team
RB Tito Ortiz: Cocky and after big money
K BJ Penn: Never Looks to strong/all form
S Forestt Griffin: Killer Mentality/Head Hunter
DL Brock: Since that is where played for the Vikes
LB Chuck Liddel: Killer Mentality/LT style crazy
RB Rampage: since we already know he can run over Chcuk and cars
TE GSP: tall lean and if he grabs u its over
WR Anderson Silva: Dont let his knees hit ur face when he jumps up to get the ball, Im lookin at u Franklin.
FB Fedor: get in his way and see what happens, Tim
DE Kimbo: let him just rush the QB but pull him on 3rd down, you know he's already gassing, keep the oxygen close
Posted By: UcantCLA (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 12:38 AM
High point- "KR: Kalib Starnes - Great runner in the open field / Speedy / Hard to hit"
Low point- "Cheick, please."
I laughed at both- but only groaned at one.
Posted By: cyks (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 12:41 AM
you wouldn't make it as a football scout. fedor armbarred god in the sistine chapel and all you would do is have him kick? ridiculous
Posted By: romano (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 08:03 AM
Great column... but just 1 request:
Please return the GIF of Bas! I laugh each and every time I see it... GSP... well... not so much.
Posted By: Guest#4366 (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 08:30 AM
I no longer believe anything the CSAC says, they've lost all credibility in my mind. The Silva question is therefore just a question in my mind, the CSAC has no impact on my thoughts of that.
Posted By: Anon (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 08:55 AM
stating a fighter's record in a given weight class isn't a factual representation of his status as a contender in that weight class, at least not in any other combat sport (including apparently MMA in general and UFC). How many times have champions moved up in weight and challenged immediately for the next weight classes belt? do you think that kelly pavlik would deny oscar delahoya a title shot because of his knockout loss the last time the golden boy fought at 160? What was BJ's record at 170 when he moved up and dominated matt hughes for the title? 0-0-0, that's what it was. You can't seperate this crap in neat little boxes, that's not the way this actually works. If a guy is in the mythical top five pound for pound list, then that guy gets to challenge for any belt he chooses because a. he's one of the best on the planet b. fighter's legacys are built on winning superfights c. it's going to make a buttload of money.
The divisional record argument holds no water in the realms of reality and logic and has never been used in any combat sport including mma, and quite frankly i'm tired of hearing about it. There are no other challengers that are more deserving because none of those guys is a. as great a fighter as BJ b. provide the legacy building for GSP that a second win over BJ would and c. would draw nearly as much money for the promotion.
"Thiago Alves and Josh Koshceck...even Carlos Condit"
let's see, josh koshceck while steadily improving is not a great fighter and was flat out wrestled by GSP when they met, what chance does he have and what interest does he build?
Thiago Alves is not a great fighter, can barely make weight and has lost to some subpar opponents...BJ's only losses are to jens, hughes, gsp, and machida!
and who in the blue hell has condit defeated to earn a shot....how in the hell does a minor league title qualify him more than bj? i believe you were going for hyperbole, but you just weakened your already weak argument in my mind.
don't get hung up on the titles, the belts mean nothing, it's all about the fighter that holds them. you can't tell me the ufc middleweight belt was worth five ounces of piss when dave menne held it and you can't tell me that the ufc lightweight title would be more valuable with florian holding it...you'd have a guy that barely breaks the top ten representing the company, instead of a pound for pound legend...these arguments make my head hurt.
Posted By: romano (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 10:05 AM
Penn vs. Pierre on Super Bowl weekend...I called it 2 weeks ago. Thank you, I told you so.
Posted By: Marcus (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 10:06 AM
Exactly, romano! Who better to kick the winning 75-yard field goal into the wind with one second left on the clock?
Posted By: Bren Oliver (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 10:10 AM
Noons is completely retarded if he is aiming for a release as you suggest. If he wants to maximize his exposure, then performing on a primetime network defending his championship belt against a popular opponent is the OPPORTUNITY HE HAS. What better scenario could you envision? Unless he is afraid of getting tooled by Diaz, then having Elite XC fold, and his stock hurt because of it. Either way, those two scenarios make him out to be an idiot or a coward. Pick your poison, Noons, and dont let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
Posted By: Jeff L (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 10:43 AM
bren - you have a guy on your squad that armbarred the almighty...if you put the ball in his hands every play and have him play middle linebacker on d, you'll never need a 75 yard fieldgoal.
fedor vs. God and all his angels - FAAY-DOR
Fedor vs. Ditka in a charity golf match - FAAY - Dor
Fedor vs. 1992 Michael Jordon in Horse - FAAY - Dor
i just don't see how you can argue with my logic on this one sir.
Posted By: romano (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 11:27 AM
"To be honest, at this point, I would have no problem with EliteXC stripping KJ Noons of his championship due to insubordination and releasing him from his contract. And, in further personal disclosure, I'm starting to be a bit suspicious that's exactly what Noons' camp wants."
_____________________________________
What would be the fun in that? Why should they release him?
Keep him under contract indefinitely so he can't sign and fight elsewhere... while keeping the problem (his refusal to fight) in the news. Either he'll eventually fold and fight- or he'd have issues with any other organizations signing him.
There's no way Dana would put up with that kind of nonsense.
Posted By: cyks (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 11:41 AM
"Thiago Alves is not a great fighter, can barely make weight and has lost to some subpar opponents...BJ's only losses are to jens, hughes, gsp, and machida! "
___________________________________
Funny how you say he's not a great fighter, when his most recent win is Penn's most recent loss.
Penn has not beaten a ranked top 10 fighter since his first fight with Hughes... almost 5 years ago.
You say that belts mean nothing, that it's the fighters holding them who make the difference... but that works both ways. Belts make the fighters just as much.
Dave Menne?!? Did you really have to go back 7 or so years to try to make your point?
Posted By: cyks (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 12:14 PM
FAAY-DOR is a tool. Congrats
Posted By: Guest#4297 (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 12:23 PM
FAAY-DOR is a tool. Congrats
Posted By: Guest#0528 (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 12:26 PM
cyks - you're falling into MMAmath here bud...and i usually like your posts....you can't even compare the matt hughes that got beaten by alves to the matt hughes that survived the bj fight long enough for bj to "hurt his ribs"....as far as dave menne..i was riffing dude, whenever i think of sucky champs he comes to mind first...whatever....most of the top ten lists i've seen had stevenson and sherk ranked at the time that bj beat them...unless you're just talking about the welterweight division, but the whole first part of my post talked about the unrealistic nature of that kind of thought process in combat sports...so again, whatever...Alves is NOT a great fighter, and may never become one...so i'm not sure what you're arguing with.
guest - you must be too young to remember the superfans skit on snl...it just popped in my head and personally, it cracked me up....but then again i have an odd sense of humor.
Posted By: romano (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 02:15 PM
...and before Penn, Sherk had only lost twice- to GSP and Hughes... but I wouldn't dare say that Penn fought the same Sherk that they had.
Stevenson and Sherk were ranked (barely) in the LW division when they fought Penn... Sherk may have been as high as #5 and Stevenson (might) have reached #9. Can't compare LW to WW though- as the UFC only has 3-4 of the top 10 LW opposed to 7-8 of the WW under contract.
So again, who has Penn beaten in the past 5 years that was a top ranked world fighter?
Granted, come Jan 31st- I could be proven wrong and Penn could destroy GSP in the first.... I just seriously doubt it and even if he does, I'd still feel he hadn't done anything to deserve that shot.
Belt holders can challenge other belts? Sure- if the divisions are equal and you've already proven yourself dominant in your own. That's not the case here. The majority of the LW division is a bunch of WW's that couldn't fight against Hughes/ GSP... Penn included.
Since they last fought, GSP's entire game has gone up a few notches.... while Penn has worked on his cardio- or rather, Penn was forced to work on his cardio in order to hit the 155lb limit.
Posted By: cyks (Registered) on August 25, 2008 at 04:23 PM
romano, did you not once say that rankings dont matter? why would you go back on your word like that. and im sorry, but ditka would beat fedor via death... and jordan would beat him via gogoplata 10 seconds into the fight
Posted By: hendo (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 06:01 PM
cyks - you're definitely forgetting Gomi...you're underrating sherk and stevenson...and you're forgetting that BJ, whether you agree or not, is a friggin' legend! and no not a ken shamrock feed the lamb to the young lions legend, but BJ is the real deal and deserves to fight anyone...period.
and you keep going back to what BJ did as a welterweight when i said that it doesn't matter, backed my statement up with real world examples and have yet to see you give me a reason to doubt my logic.
like i said, i like ya cyks, but i don't think that you're thinking straight on this one...BJ rub ya the wrong way? or is it that you fell in love with mma watching florian and koscheck and sanchez washing each other's hair on the reality show? either way, this fight is good for the sport...good for the fighters (and not just gsp and bj, but every mma fighter on the planet)...and great for the fans...stop whining about it.
missed ya hendo....rankings don't mean shit to dana or anyone else making matches in this sport, but i begrudgingly admit that it means something to us loser, obsessive fans...faay-dor beats everybody via anything that comes to mind.
Posted By: romano (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 06:54 PM
I didn't forget about Gomi... I asked what Penn would have done in the last 5 years to warrant the WW title shot- which will happen 5 years to the day of when Penn beat Hughes. Gomi happened before that.
Of course, if you care to play semantics - fine... what has Penn done in the last 4 years 10 months?
Not selling Stevenson or Sherk short... they're just not that great. Even when he was the champ, Sherk barely broke the top 5 LW's.
Sherk should have had a better showing, but the 10 month break, steroid issue, and him deciding to stand up and strike for the first time in his career didn't do him any favors.
I'm not saying Sherk would definitely have won, but he would have much better odds had he used his tried and tested lay and pray/ tire the opponent out and go for the decision or his neck.
The Sherk who fought Penn wasn't his usual self- and he all but gave the fight to Penn.
Penn fought Hughes originally while he was 0-0-0 in WW because the LW division was just closed and Hughes had already fought every possible contender in his division. Both Penn and GSP still have matches to go.
Did Penn rub me the wrong way? I feel his antics have rubbed all MMA fans the wrong way. He hasn't done anything notable in years, but feels he can still do whatever he wants because he's "the prodigy" and can do no wrong.
Amazing how Lesnar gets chastised by the community for his post fight antics with Herring- but rarely a comment is mentioned about Penn's blood fetish.
Penn didn't rub me, but it's obvious who he's blown.
Posted By: cyks (Guest) on August 25, 2008 at 11:36 PM
Please be honest and admit you picked that football team out of a hat.
Posted By: Bill Parcels (Guest) on August 26, 2008 at 12:08 AM
finally we get to the truth...you don't like penn. that's cool...now here's why he deserves the fight more than anyone else on the planet....because despite what you think, NO ONE will sell more ppvs then penn/gsp...thanks for playing.
Posted By: romano (Guest) on August 26, 2008 at 08:23 AM
"and who in the blue hell has condit defeated to earn a shot....how in the hell does a minor league title qualify him more than bj? i believe you were going for hyperbole, but you just weakened your already weak argument in my mind"
A hyperbole is a intentionally over-exaggerated literary device used to build emphasis. An example of a hyperbole would be "I ran about a thousand miles" or "I'm so hungry I could eat a nine course meal"
Bren wasn't exaggerating; Carlos Condit is a legitimate contender. This isn't poetry, and the writer wasn't trying to articulate his point by using said device.
thus, it isn't a hyperbole.
and for the record Alves' win over Hughes was faster than both of GSP's wins over Hughes. Alves is prime and ready for title contention. Don't let his weight issue last fight cloud that issue.
Posted By: Stephen DeAugustino (Registered) on August 26, 2008 at 12:38 PM
This is for Romano, how doesn't Alves deserve a title shot, he's on a 6 win streak in WW, compared to BJ's 2 win streak in LW, fact is this would be a slap in the face to all competitors in the WW division, Diego might aswell drop down and compete in LW, win 2 fights then maybe he'll get a title shot, it took fitch 8 wins at WW, Alves is on a 6 win streak in WW, BJ is on a 2 win streak in LW, how can u justify him jumping to the front of the line for beating Stevenson and Sherk?
biggest pay day? this bout has the potential to destroy both the WW and LW divisions, it takes a champ to defend his title to draw keep the division moving, with BJ only fighting 2 times a year we'd only see one title shot a year in both weight classes maybe 2 in one of them if were lucky, title fights make the most money, ex. only fights GSP headlines is when there's a belt on the line. no matter how u look at its a stupid move for the UFC
Posted By: Josh (Guest) on August 26, 2008 at 10:59 PM
