Ten Deep 09.17.09: Threequels
Posted by Owain J. Brimfield on 09.17.2009
It's the natural progression from a column about sequels, really. See if there are as many great threequels as sequels that stack up in the latest Ten Deep! And yes, I hate the term 'threequel' just as much as you.
Welcome to week 47 of 'Ten Deep'! In a slightly poetic twist, this is the sequel to last week's column but this time we'll be looking at threequels. Great, eh? But first, to business, and some:
Reactions and interactions
Firstly, step forward the following commenters: BadNews, DangerousK, Guest#6526, Frank, duh, AFan, guest, lester b. cakes and Dane
You are colossal fools. That is all.
Said colossal fools seem divided equally into those who can't read, and thus missed the whole paragraph in underlined text where I explained why The Godfather Part II would be excluded and that anyone who didn't read that opened themselves to ridicule, and those who think because I haven't seen it my opinion is "null and void", to quote one of them. To better illustrate the "quality" of these colossal fools' thought processes, duh then goes on to suggest, with a straight face, that I should have included Babe: Pig in the City, and guest thinks that Godfather II is the only sequel that's ever won an Oscar. Kudos to Dane who at least got his four brain cells working overtime and tried to come up with some form of argument, rather than simply passing unthinking judgment from his mighty throne like the others:
"This is ridiculous. Know what you do if you haven't seen one of the movies that are bound to make the list? You go see them!! .. Why not delay the column a few weeks?"
Of course, I could have done that... actually there were a few sequels I haven't seen that could have made the list more comprehensive, so I'd better delay that column till I can watch them. Of course, that means delaying this week's column too since it's thematically similar. Guess I could do the next topic I have scheduled instead... oh wait, there are a few movies I could do with seeing to make that one more complete, too. And the next column. And the next. And the next. Geez, I guess I'd better suspend the column till I've seen every film you think I should see, right? After all, cinema would be much better if everyone watched exactly the same films.
This is what we philosophers call a reductio ad absurdum, which is really a fancy way of saying "your argument sucks". As castmeastheriddlerchris also points out:
"I think it's a bit harsh to criticise someone for not having seen certain films... I'm sure a lot of those carping on about not seeing Godfather II haven't seen a lot of (to some) amazing films and wouldn't expect to be chastised for those."
Exactly. And no, actually, I don't remember watching Man Bites Dog... weird.
Anyway, thusly humiliated, colossal fools, go home and think about what you've done while I get on with the rest of the feedback.
Actually, before I do, thanks to Guest#7953 who quickly dispatches a number of other comments...
"Why are people listing sequels of sequels when this is about sequels... not the sequel of sequels"
Quite right. That's what this week's column is for!
Elsewhere, Joseph Lee implies I copied his column idea... would I do such a thing, Joseph? For shame! *runs to hide notes and delete all traces of browsing history*
James suggests that playing with structure is one of Nolan's hallmarks, but I think that's different when applied to, say, The Prestige, which relies heavily on the disjointed structure, than when looking at The Dark Knight, which is largely conventional from a storytelling point of view in terms of structure but still manages to lose its flow from time to time.
A quality suggestion from YepYep, From Russia With Love. I could try and argue the case that it's not a direct sequel or something, but fair play, that one should really have made the list.
Malik has a brilliant list of alternative suggestions which made me chortle no end, thanks for that good sir.
neverAcquiesce reckons Memento is better than The Dark Knight. Controversial! Any takers?
There's little to explain about this week's list, it makes sense following on from a "best sequels" list, although apologies in advance if this turns out to be a little too similar to last week's column. Threequels have an even dodgier reputation than sequels in terms of maintaining a series' quality, so it'll be interesting to see just how many good ones we can find. And yes, I despise the term 'threequel', just like I hate 'quadrilogy', but it's a lot more practical to keep using than 'second sequel'. Hey, at least there'll be no one clamoring that I should have included Godfather III... right?
Oh, and for what it's worth, I apologize in advance that I just don't get along with Army of Darkness. Feel free to throw all your mockery my way for that one as I'm well aware it's deserved and it's one of the few films I actually feel genuinely bad about disliking.
As always, there's one golden rule: if I haven't seen it, it's not allowed on the list.
This week's golden rule notable omissions: A Nightmare on Elm Street 3, Infernal Affairs 3, Rocky III, Shrek the Third, Sympathy for Lady Vengeance
Honorable mention: Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban
I'm no big fan of the Potter movies, but this was the best in the series thus far.
10. Mission: Impossible III
I'd actually hoped that M:I 3 was simply going to be slotted in as an honorable mention by virtue of Philip Seymour Hoffman's wonderfully hammy performance as the bad guy, whose name escapes me right now. Unfortunately I could only find nine films I thought actually worthy of making the list itself, so here comes the Cruiser to make up the numbers. Where the first film was a low-key slice of screen subterfuge topped with an awesome helicopter/train set-piece, and the second film consisted solely of the nation's rubber mask-makers giggling in delight at the overwhelming quantities of their produce the filmmakers deemed it necessary to consume, the third entry in the loose trilogy is played in pretty straightforward fashion, with Ethan Hunt leaving the family life behind to save the girl and salvage his reputation from the clutches of Bourne and Bond. As we all know, though, J.J. Abrams is apparently incapable of doing anything less than decent when it comes to televisual media, so what could have been an exercise in diminishing returns turns out to be a surprisingly enjoyable actioner, helped in no small part by a remarkably hefty budget. Cruise does balls-to-the-wall action better than any other insane midget on the market right now, and while M:I 3 never hits the heights of, say, Minority Report in terms of providing substance to go along with the style, it remains a classy and flashy blockbuster. Plus, Hoffman's snarling turn elevates his antagonist above the generic action baddie stereotype, proving that despite his uncanny resemblance to one of those base-weighted clown dummies you had as a kid that you'd punch over and it'd spring right back up (no? Just me then), he's actually believably nasty when he sets his mind to it. I'm not exactly clamoring for M:I 4, but the third film in the series does nicely for a couple of hours of mindless popcorn entertainment.
9. Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines
A lot of people seem down on Rise of the Machines, which is something that's always confused me. Sure, there's no way it lives up to the standards set by James Cameron's first two films in the franchise, classics both, but what it does offer is a neat addition to the canon timeline and a pleasing blast of SF-action. While the film could certainly have benefited from being made several years earlier - Arnie hasn't exactly aged as gracefully as a cyborg in the intervening years - it's still pretty effective as a Terminator flick and, satisfyingly, not above self-parody, as witnessed in the retread of T2's biker scene with a bit of a feminist twist. Despite the dull villain, who you have to think was shoe-horned into the mix because someone thought up the name 'Terminatrix' and decided it was to cool to drop, Jonathan Mostow directs the action scenes with aplomb, with the car chase featuring Arnie hanging from the back of a crane and plowing through a series of buildings being particularly impressive. Arguably more so though is that (admittedly with a few scenes of heavy exposition) the events of T3 add to and enrich the complex time travel storyworld of the previous flicks, at least until you try and cram the subsequent Sarah Connor Chronicles in on top of it. While Nick Stahl may not exactly make for the most charismatic John Connor (a shame, as the guy can be on top of his game when he wants to be, check out Bully if you've never seen it), he has enough chemistry with Claire Danes that their various travails and the film's fiendishly clever final twist work well on the screen. Still, if you want charisma, Arnie still has it in spades, proving that even in his 50s the Governator remains the coolest action hero of all, and that T3 retains enough of its predecessors' magic to be worthy of recommendation.
8. Back to the Future Part III
This one should make the list for Michael J. Fox's hilarious attempt at portraying his own Irish ancestor, a work of (somewhat unintentional) comic genius unparalleled in, well, the history of Michael J. Fox. Anyway, the ridiculous comedy stylings of Seamus McFly aside, the third and final entry in the Back to the Future trilogy (although surely it's not long now before some slavish Hollywood underling suggests a reboot to his mighty studio overlords) is quite a different beast to its predecessors, sending the action back into the Wild West with all the childish impunity it can muster, and daring you not to be entertained by Marty's attempts to help Doc Brown harness time travel using the mighty power of steam locomotion. It's pretty much a big screen version of a playground game of 'Cowboys & Indians' with a big old schoolboy helping of time travel thrown in for good measure. It works, though - there's been enough goodwill engendered by the previous two films that we're willing to forgive Part III's forays into the ludicrous and instead enjoy them for what they are, nothing more than a genuine attempt to entertain. Thankfully, for what the film may lack in terms of intellectual content (even if the concept of giving Emmett a love interest works surprisingly well), it loses none of the series' sense of the fantastic, and it's as giddily enjoyable as its prequels from start to finish, even if it really wasn't all that necessary to actually make. Of course, that sense of creative freedom isn't taken to the extreme, and it doesn't diminish Marty's eventual reunion with his (confusingly recast) lady friend, or Doc Brown's presumed voyages into the ether aboard his magic steam train, which combine to form a perfectly neat conclusion to the trilogy. It's by no means as classic as the first film, and it doesn't have hoverboards, but BttF 3 is still gloriously entertaining in its own right.
7. Day of the Dead
Another week, another Romero (next week: best fourquels, featuring Land of the Dead... or not). I don't think I've actually highlighted Day of the Dead individually before, though, so I do have an excuse other than blanket coverage for all the man's old zombie films. Day is a film that's remarkably bleak, even by the standards of its two predecessors, which despite showing a country slowly being overrun and overpowered by the undead did offer glimmers of hope. The third flick in the trilogy, though, takes the negative-ometer and rams it into overdrive - this may well be one of the darkest films ever made, and for that reason it'd probably make my hypothetical top three scariest films (along with The Thing and maybe The Shining). Taking the zombie onslaught theory and running with it for some time after the events of Dawn of the Dead, Day relegates the action to a military bunker utterly surrounded by ghouls on all sides, which is seemingly the only kind of stronghold that could be left standing in the country, perhaps the world. As is always the way, the army guys in charge come into constant and escalating conflict with the civilians (and the idiot scientist who thinks keeping a live zombie chained up is a good idea), and the tension that builds as a result of this dichotomy is almost unbearable by the point that the unthinkable/inevitable happens and the bunker's walls are breached. While the previous films relied more on the visceral horror of the zombie attacks to build the suspense, Day is more in tune with the nihilistic world view that escape just isn't really possible when you're knee deep in the dead. Of course, that doesn't stop the gory moments from shining too, key among which comes when Cpt. Rhodes is literally torn asunder by marauding zombies... nasty. Is it better than its prequels? Hard to say, but it's certainly up there, and more than worthy of inclusion on its own merits.
6. Return of the Jedi
I might as well get this out of the way: Return of the Jedi is my favorite film of all time. That doesn't mean I consider it the best film of all time though, and as evidenced by its placement here, it simply means I'll show it a little bit more bias than I would any other film. That out of the way, pretty much the only reason anyone ever gives as to why RotJ has a less than stellar reputation when compared to its predecessors, is "Ewoks". However, regardless of the debatable merits of the furry little buggers - and I personally think they're great (besides, Jar-Jar Binks makes the Ewoks look like fucking Shaft) - let's take them out of the equation, and instead examine a film that does everything A New Hope and Empire did, just bigger and *cough* better. Oh, and before I forget, let's take that execrable musical number from Jabba's Palace in the Special Edition out of the picture, too. Anyway, those things aside, RotJ is where the saga comes full circle, with the final triumph of good over the Dark Side and complete with the greatest space battle ever committed to film. If the Battle of Endor and Luke's showdown with the Emperor don't represent one of the best final acts to a series ever seen, then I don't know what does. There's also the smaller scale moments, from Yoda's death to Leia quietly realizing that she made out with her brother in the last film, as well as the endless water-cooler philosophical ponderings, like just what was the Rebel Alliance's moral stance concerning all those contractors on board the Death Star? For building on the foundations laid down by Episodes IV and V and for capping off the greatest film trilogy ever, RotJ deserves your respect even if you do have a hatred for teddy bears that can inexplicably take down a legion of stormtroopers.
5. The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King
Or "the film of a thousand endings", as it should really be subtitled. Just be thankful they didn't try and find a way of cramming in Tolkien's appendices to really push things past the five hour mark. Anyway, if you're not a fan of the Rings trilogy then there's really no way you're going to like this, let alone agree that it's the best of the three, as a substantial portion of the film is devoted to tying up all the loose ends of the previous nine or ten hours worth of story, which is an epic undertaking in itself. Of course, there's also the Battle of Pelennor Fields to fit in, which despite the at times ropey CGI remains one of the great screen battles, not to mention the climax of Frodo's quest (and bumlove for Samwise) and the downfall of Sauron and all its associated consequences. Oh, and the titular return, which is actually somewhat underplayed, if that were conceivable in such a vast tapestry of a film. As is becoming somewhat of a recurring theme in this list, the smaller moments beneath all the relentless epic-ry still manage to shine through, most poignant of which is Pippin's song for Denethor while the Gondorians ride to their doom in Osgiliath. Having said that, Return of the King really is all about the bombast of drawing a twelve-hour cinematic story to a close, and when the death throes of Mordor have settled there's as big a collective exhaling of breath as you'll find in any of this week's films. Oh, and of course, there's also the fact the film is indirectly responsible for one of the bestest YouTube clips ever, which immediately earns it eleventy billion cool points:
4. The Bourne Ultimatum
The third Bourne flick seems to have become the byword in recent years for "good threequel", and it's an accolade that's well deserved, even of some that might be merited by its release in a period of time when there wasn't much competition for that title, save our previous entry. I'm still undecided as to whether Ultimatum outweighs its daddy Identity as the best spy flick of the decade, and I probably need to rewatch it before forming that judgment, but I can say for (almost) certain it's the best third film of the decade. Combining the best elements of the previous two films and fusing them into one wonderfully high-octane thriller packed with the best set-pieces of the trilogy (to wit, the horridly tense hunting of Paddy Considine's character through a packed train station, with its totally unexpected climax, and a foot chase through cramped buildings that proves you don't have to be in a vehicle to have a great cinema chase sequence). While the revelations of the final act may not quite live up to the standards of the rest, it's an admirable attempt to draw the series back to its beginnings and give a sense of closure, although of course it works just as well if they're going to go for a fourth movie after all (The Bourne Redundancy, right?). Critics like the chap from last week's comments section may well deride its abundance of shaky-cam and deviations from the source text, but the latter is just desperation for criticism, and the former, while a valid critique of a number of films, just doesn't apply here, with the handheld camera techniques honed even further than those displayed in Supremacy. As far as threequels bettering their former movies, there aren't many better examples than The Bourne Ultimatum. Well, there are three, but you'd already guessed that hadn't you.
3. Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade
The original Indiana Jones trilogy, seemingly more so than any other cinematic franchise, has constant debate rage as to the relative merits of its three films, but if any consensus can be found (and it's the one that I agree with), Last Crusade beats out Temple of Doom by a decent margin and comes in second to Raiders of the Lost Ark. Still, considering that Raiders may well be the best action-adventure film of all time, second best is still a pretty worthy ranking. For those who complained about the antics of latter-day fourquel Kingdom of the Crystal Skull going overboard with extra-terrestrial silliness, let's not forget that Last Crusade sees Indy getting Hitler's autograph and finding the Holy Grail (guarded by requisite centuries-old knight), which cures all ailments. Maybe the difference is that Last Crusade has just the right amount of tongue wedged firmly in its cheek to remain grounded in reality while still allowing for some excess here and there. It's helped in that respect by Sean Connery and Harrison Ford's bickering as father and son, the two of them as great a screen duo as you could wish for, and responsible for antics both comic and tragic (sometimes both at the same time, as in the wonderful scene where Henry thinks his son has gone over the edge of a cliff trying to take down a tank). Frankly any film sufficiently self-assured to manage to pull off a literal ride into the sunset as its final scene is worthy of any plaudits you can throw its way, even if you'd have to figure if anyone could pull that chestnut off it would be Senor Spielbergo. And as the feather in the cap, the film features Michael Sheard, the terrifying Mr. Bronson from beloved UK kids' show Grange Hill, as Hitler in a role he was surely born to play. Arguably the best "conclusion to a trilogy" threequel here, but for my money, not quite the best overall.
2. Die Hard With a Vengeance
I can't believe I nearly forgot about this one when compiling the list. I may have been spoiled by living for a while with another guy who also thought that ...With a Vengeance was more entertaining than the original Die Hard, but I'm still convinced that's the case, hence its surprisingly high inclusion here. Sure, it's technically an inferior movie to its daddy, and nowhere near as important an action movie, but damned if it isn't super-satisfying to watch. Teaming Bruce Willis with Samuel L. Jackson was an inspired move, with Jackson's irate shopkeeper Zeus Carver being about the only man you could think of as providing a suitable sidekick to John McClane, and their fiery interactions recalling the glorious tandem of Willis and Wayans in The Last Boy Scout. You know this isn't your dad's action movie near the start when McClane pops out of a police van in Harlem, wearing nothing but his pants and a giant billboard reading "I Hate Niggers" to preserve his modesty, if not his health. Given that this follows a giant department store explosion to cap off the opening credits, it's clear from the outset that this isn't going to be subtle. The frantic game of 'Simon Says' that lead villain Jeremy Irons (campest bad guy ever?) plays with our heroic duo leads to a frenetic charge around New York with explosions and bullets flying hither and thither, as McClane tries to unearth the meat of the baddies' plot, which turns out to be surprisingly complex for a supposedly brainless actioner. With Willis in the lead as one of cinema's most likeable unintentional heroes, the fact the movie runs to nearly two and a half hours goes by unnoticed, and for my money Die Hard With a Vengeance remains one of the best action movies of the 90s.
1. The Good, the Bad and the Ugly
Indisputable proof, should you need it in some bizarre conversation or other, that threequels don't necessarily need to have Roman numerals somewhere in the title. While Sergio Leone's Dollars trilogy is much more loosely connected than any of the other franchises here this week, with the only really tangible connecting thread being Clint Eastwood's notorious Man With No Name, The Good, the Bad and the Ugly is a prime example of taking what worked in the previous films, reworking it into the mix of something altogether grander, and sewing it all together into one magnificent tapestry. The film is one of those few works that, from a cinematic perspective, is essentially flawless (don't believe me? Ask Tarantino, who has previously labeled this one of the best-directed films in history), from the spellbinding and tumultuous three-way dynamic of the titular characters to the stunning Ennio Morricone score (which you may remember I also crowned the best movie score in a not-too-recent edition of 'Ten Deep'). Perhaps the greatest film in its genre, and although I won't claim to be a fan of westerns in any way, this is pretty much only rivalled by Leone's own Once Upon a Time in the West for the title of "best western" (hey, maybe somebody should do a column on that subject...). By these standards, predecessor A Fistful of Dollars, itself a damn respectable film, looks positively bog-standard in comparison, and to achieve that is pretty special - in terms of raising the bar, you can't really get any higher than this. Anyway, now you have the perfect counter-argument next time someone claims The Godfather Part III proves that second sequels are shit, or indeed that The Good, the Bad and the Ugly is anything less than a masterpiece.
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And finally…
Feeling aggrieved or elated at this week's ten picks? Then let me know! The magic of the interweb allows you to post your comments right here on this very page, and if they're especially insightful (or idiotic), I may even respond in the next column. Be sure to tune in next week for another edition of 'Ten Deep', but until then - keep watching the skies.
Good list, just missing Rocky 3 (Underrated movie) and Godfather 3 for sure
Posted By: Kevin (Guest) on September 16, 2009 at 11:04 PM
I'm watching you, Brimfield.
I would have thrown in "Mother of Tears" as an honorable mention, as it finally wrapped up Dario Argento's "Mother" trilogy with a bloody finish. But I can't really argue with what you have.
Posted By: Joseph Lee (Registered) on September 16, 2009 at 11:09 PM
Funny that you mentioned From Russia With Love - it would've been nice to see Goldfinger here.
Posted By: Guest017 (Guest) on September 16, 2009 at 11:12 PM
have you seen Babe: Pig in the City? if not, how can you say it's idiotic? And the reason every one mentioned the Godfather Part 2 is that the film is unquestionably the best sequel of all time and would top your list.
Posted By: duh (Guest) on September 16, 2009 at 11:24 PM
Wow, Die Hard 3 is #2.
You fail.
Posted By: Guest#4955 (Guest) on September 16, 2009 at 11:27 PM
"Not even God knows what you're doing"
Pretty good picks.
Here's some that I included (including one on your Golden Omissions).
Nightmare on Elm St. 3: After the horridness that was #2, Nightmare 3 was a solid return to form, bringing back Nancy, and getting a pretty decent cast of potential victims. And unlike the subsequent films, it wasn't so overdone with cheese that it overwhelmed the plot.
Goldfinger: The third film in the official James Bond series--widely acknoweldged as the best by many. This was the film that perfected the formula for Bond: beautiful locales, and beautiful women, evil villain with requisite henchman creating some outrageous scheme to cause lots of death while making money in the process, and the gadgets. To a lesser extent, The Spy Who Loved Me could be a mini-threequal, as it's the third film with Roger Moore, and arguably the best one from that actor.
Good discussion==how about a list of worst sequels or threequels?
Posted By: Michael L (Guest) on September 16, 2009 at 11:29 PM
I always loved Jedi more than the other 2 as well as oppose to most people. The Final duel between Luke Vader and The Emperor is one of the most epic scenes ever.
Posted By: joe5566 (Guest) on September 16, 2009 at 11:36 PM
Return of the Jedi should be at the top, no question.
And no love for Chasing Amy, the third part of the New Jersey Chronicles that Kevin Smith still hasnt finished?
Oh, and the Sarah Connor Chronicles is non-canon, but had some awesome ideas. ^_^
Posted By: Guest#3259 (Guest) on September 16, 2009 at 11:41 PM
Good list. Personally I feel the Bourne trilogy is overrated, so I would have put the Return of the King and Return of the Jedi at #4 and #5 respectively, but other than that I agree for the most part.
Posted By: Mattheapar (Guest) on September 16, 2009 at 11:47 PM
Too much cheese in Last Crusade.
I'll take the Temple of Doom over the woefully over-rated Last Crusade any day. Even with the annoying chick.
I think you exaggerate the consensus.
Posted By: Heyyo (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 12:14 AM
Great list, Rocky 3 is the best in that series apart from Rocky, I personally think it's tied with Rocky Balboa for second best in that series.
I'm sad you haven't seen Nightmare 3, apart from the original it's the best.
Also, BttF 3 is my personal favorite.
Posted By: Last_Rider (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 12:14 AM
When I was reading the list and got to about #4 I was disappointed thinking that Die Hard: With A Vengeance hadn't made it cause there was no way it would be that high- awesome choice at #2.
Babe: Pig In The City is horrible -I have seen it. The only people who have probably seen that movie AND Godfather 2 are probably people who work with kids or parents. Judging by your name and punctuation I pray that you are neither a teacher or parent.
That leads me to believe you are about 11 years old. It would justify you enjoying 'Babe'. Plus you just think (rightly, as it turns out) that Godfather 2 is super awesome because your parents told you it is an 'adult movie' and it might give you nightmares.
Posted By: Jared (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 12:21 AM
What No Rocky 3? I pity you fool!
Posted By: Andre (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 12:49 AM
good list
weren't you surprised that MI 3 wasn't the worst movie ever? i know i was.
Posted By: scientology rules (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 01:03 AM
Yes! Best western films Column!
BOOK IT!!!
Posted By: clint (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 01:05 AM
Good job on the past two weeks, Owain, as all are largely choices I would have made as well. However, it got me thinking: would there be places on the lists for sequels (and threequels) for Trilogies that are sequential of one another not through means of plot or continuity of story or whatnot, but sequential through themes/ideas/motifs? I'm talking of Baz Luhrmann and his Red Curtain Trilogy (Strictly Ballroom, Romeo and Juliet, and Moulin Rouge...tied through the idea of performance arts or dancing/poetry/song) or Terry Gilliam and his Trilogy of Imagination (Time Bandits, Brazil, and The Adventures of Baron Munchausen, tied through the use of imagination being the most powerful tool we possess). If so, I wouldn't mind one bit seeing both Moulin Rouge and Munchausen added to the list.
Posted By: Lucas Huddleston (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 01:32 AM
I'm a fan of the Die Hard Series, that's simply the best "Threequels" I've seen.
Also LOTR despite the loopholes in the story, the ending of the trilogy is SWEET (that gave justice to the hardships of the "Fellowship" that disposes the ring") in every sense of the word.
Posted By: Irvin Ryan (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 01:44 AM
No Matrix Revolutions!??! No Karate Kid III!?!?
Posted By: CryptoBiz (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 02:15 AM
I think you're a mind reader cause I've felt the exact same way about Die Hard With a Vengeance for years. Not as important as the first one, but the most entertaining for sure.
Posted By: Guest#5983 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 02:50 AM
Nitpicking I know, but BTTF3 did have the hoverboard. Clara never would have been saved without it!
Posted By: Twitch (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 06:09 AM
Rocky 3 definitely shoulda been on the list over MI:3 or even the Bourne movie.
What about Escape from the Planet of the Apes.....jk lol
Posted By: jaked (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 06:33 AM
What the hell? No Revenge of the Sith? That was the best Star Wars film aside of Empire!!
Posted By: MitchellMan (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 07:18 AM
Good list and good to see some love for Michael Sheard. Hitler, Admiral from Empire Strikes Back and Mr. Bronson. The man could play evil. A bit like Christopher Lee
Posted By: Flyin' Bryan (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 07:44 AM
army of darkness?
Posted By: Guest#2238 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 08:22 AM
You need to do a WORST #rd movie...Beverly Hills Cop 3 DESTROYED the series, and may be the worst movie ever made (in story, directing, acting...everything about it was so opposite from the first 2...)
Posted By: Mike (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 08:32 AM
Yes! Best western films Column!
BOOK IT!!!
Posted By: clint (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 01:05 AM
Didn't they not too long ago do a Top 50 or Top 100 Western column that spanned a week? :P
Despite all the commenters ranting and raving about how much your lists suck, I personally find them interesting to read. While I wouldn't agree with all of them, it offers consideration to other films to see how someone else ranks their favorites. Kudos.
Posted By: Joe (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 08:57 AM
LOTR should be first... shut up haters
Posted By: Visakh (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 09:04 AM
i don't necessarily agree with "die hard 3" at #2...it was a good action flick, yes, but definitely not as good as 1 or 2, and 3 played the racist angle so mcuh it actually got annoying after a while.
i'm happy to see "jedi" not #1...great flick, yes, but one word...ewoks. that kinda ruined it for me.
"terminator 3" was one of the worst movies i have ever seen. jmho.
and my #1 would be "the last crusade". what a movie. sean connery played indy's father so well, and the action and story were amazing.
btw, i noticed your ommissions, and i highly recommend "rocky 3". go watch it. except for the part where rocky and apollo are hugging in the ocean...that you can fast forward through.
Posted By: quilombo (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 09:24 AM
I don't know if they would have made your list but Nightmare on Elm St. 3 is one of the better(in my opinion) Freddy movies, so you should check it(plus you can normally buy it pretty cheap). Also, I can't believe you haven't seen Rocky 3. I know for a long time that TNT and TBS used to show the Rocky series(except 5, I think) all the time. It's pretty good too, if you like Rocky movies. Sadly, I don't think I've seen any of the movies you have on your list though. Maybe because if the first movie is bad, then why would I want to watch a sequel? and if the first movie is good, why would I want to watch a sequel that might ruin the first one?
Posted By: JWestmoreland (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 09:45 AM
Just so you all know, Roger Ebert put Babe: Pig In The City in his top ten films of that year. And don't forget that the first Babe was nominated for many Oscars.
Posted By: Pig Lover (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 10:16 AM
Actually Gene Siskel picked Babe: Pig In The City to be the best film of that year. And the first Babe was nominated for 7 Oscars including Best Picture.
Posted By: Mr. C. (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 10:17 AM
The very first commenter cracked me up!
Regarding Babe: Pig in the City, Gene Siskel actually said on "At the Movies" that this was the film of the year. Of course he also had a brain tumor at the time.
Posted By: Guest#9949 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 10:57 AM
Why no Goldfinger? Best Bond movie of all time.
Posted By: champzilla (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 11:08 AM
Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines was awful... where the hell is Rocky III or American Wedding? Both of those films more so Rocky should be on this list. Ricky III was the birth of the eye of the tiger a song that will live forever in popculture
Posted By: TheGreg (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 11:22 AM
Friday the 13th Part 3 is regarded by most as the best of the series and it introduced the hockey mask making Jason a slasher icon.
Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban is the best of that series.
Posted By: ScottyFlamingo (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 11:43 AM
Owain I was gonna bitch at you for not making Return of the King number 1, but you made up for it by choosing The Good, the Bad and the Ugly. A really great film. Good column sir.
Posted By: paco smith (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 12:12 PM
I would argue with Return of the King, not based on quality or whatever, but because it really stretches the idea of "sequel". Generally, sequels are additions to stories that would normally stand alone. Lord of the Rings is one long story split into three parts. Most of the other films could easily have stood alone without being part of a "franchise", even Star Wars and Back to the Future, but LotR is obviously different.
It might seem like nitpicking, but I consider it an important distinction.
Posted By: The Tortoise King (Registered) on September 17, 2009 at 01:41 PM
I'm suprised that Leathal Weapon 3 didn't make the list. Granted, it was remarkably similar to other buddy-cop movies (including the first 2 Leathal weapon movies), but it still ended up being a very entertaining movie.
Posted By: Seg (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 01:54 PM
"And no love for Chasing Amy, the third part of the New Jersey Chronicles that Kevin Smith still hasnt finished?"
While I agree that 'Amy' was a fantastic movie, I will have to point you to Clerks II, the ending (for now) of the Jersey Chronicles. KS has even said that he is done with Jay and Silent Bob/Jersey for a while.
Posted By: Swarley (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 02:18 PM
you gotta give in to them Owain. They're not gonna shut the fuck up, so just list movies you haven't seen. Integrity be damned.
Posted By: the danger stranger (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 02:21 PM
Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade is definitely one of the best sequels of all time. In fact, I think it's better than Raiders of the Lost Ark. Don't get me wrong. Raiders was more groundbreaking, but Last Crusade was better. There are very few movies that can pull off the perfect amount of action, drama, and comedy, while also featuring a top-notch script with memorable characters, excellent acting, great music and everything else. The relationship between Indy and his dad was one of the best things in the movie, especially when Indy would do something that he thought was great, and his dad would look unimpressed. And it was really smart for Spielberg and Lucas to get back to the two things that were in Raiders that were sorely lacking in Temple of Doom (one of the worst sequels of all time, though maybe not even the worst in its own series because of Kingdom of the Crystal Skulls): 1. Nazis are the bad guys, and 2. Indy trying to stop said Nazis from acquiring a Biblical artifact that would enable them to take over the world. The two movies in the franchise that feature those elements are great. The two that don't are abominable.
I could go on and on about what a great movie it is, but I think that's enough for now.
Posted By: John Gale (Registered) on September 17, 2009 at 03:14 PM
Man, you got my top 3, although Indy would trade places with Die Hard 3. Fantastic list, only thing I would change would be T3(not a bad film, just nowhere near as good as the first two) and replace it with Army of Darkness or something.
Posted By: Jeremy (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 03:21 PM
seriously?
no Police Academy 3?
This list is a complete sham, I'm going home.
Posted By: furey (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 05:00 PM
Anakin vs Obi Wan in revenge of the sith was one of the best fight scenes ever(using king of the castle rules to end it? brilliant.) and that film does kicks ass... Doesn't make up for the whole SW prequel shit as a whole, but still FAR and away superior to the tragically cornball Return of the Jedi. I remember seeing it with friends back in'84 and feeling incredibly let down-but with Sith I was incredibly surprised at how awesome it was.
Posted By: Benny Lava (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 05:53 PM
Die Hard with a Vengeance over LOTR:T3T? Yeesh!
Posted By: Guest#5363 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 05:58 PM
TOSHIRO MIFUNE + YOJIMBO = GREATNESS
Posted By: x-0816 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 06:02 PM
Revenge of the Sith is technically the 6th movie in the series so i can see it not being on here. However no Rocky 3(Eye of the tiger dammit!)? No Goldmember(the funniest of the 3 Austin Powers movies)? This list needs a do over lol
Posted By: Guest#1777 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 06:33 PM
It's certainly not the best, and it takes its lumps, but I liked Beyond Thunderdome more than MI3, BTTF3, Machines and ROTK.
Oh, and by the way, Chasing Amy B-L-O-W-S. "Our relationship is damaged, and I want to fix it. Here's my plan: a 3-way with my best friend. It's the only solution, and it'll solve all our problems."
I don't care how flowery you think the dialogue is, this is not quality writing.
Posted By: fender (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 07:19 PM
What? No Halloween 3? For Shame. :)
Posted By: JLAJRC (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 07:33 PM
NO ONE is here mentioned SUPERMAN III? REALLY? Fuckin' Richard Pryor! Superman's drunken rampage - incluuding straightening the Eifel tower?!
And that youtube clip with Robocop? WTF?
Posted By: Guest#9581 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 08:31 PM
"NO ONE is here mentioned SUPERMAN III? REALLY? Fuckin' Richard Pryor! Superman's drunken rampage - incluuding straightening the Eifel tower?! "
Posted By: Guest#9581 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 08:31 PM
Yes, no one here is mentioning this. It did not happen in the movie. The Eiffel Tower is already straight. I do, however, want to mention that you are way to drunk, way too early in the evening.
Posted By: Guest#8001 (Guest) on September 17, 2009 at 09:48 PM
No Matrix Revolutions!??! No Karate Kid III!?!?
Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines was awful... where the hell is Rocky III or American Wedding?
Friday the 13th Part 3 is regarded by most as the best of the series and it introduced the hockey mask making Jason a slasher icon.
Matrix Revolutions and Karate Kid III sucked big time. Rocky III is in the notable omissions list you awful jackass, and American Wedding?!? I don’t even have words for how terrible that movie was. I don’t understand all of the hate for T3. Sure it wasn’t as good as the other two, but it was still a great action flick, and the ending was great. I can see why Friday the 13th 3 is iconic, but I’ve never heard anyone call it the best of the series. It’s actually pretty awful…
I pretty much agree with your list. Love Die Hard with A Vengeance, even if the ending was sort of lackluster. I can understand your omission of Army of Darkness. I love the series as a whole, but Army of Darkness is probably my least favorite. Keep up the good work sir…
Trancers 3 anyone?!? Hello? Is this thing on….
Posted By: Mario (Guest) on September 18, 2009 at 03:37 AM
I saw Mission Impossible 3 at #10 and immediately lost all credibility. Then I see ROTK only at #5...I usually don't comment on these things but this list sucks.
Posted By: Matt (Guest) on September 18, 2009 at 08:28 AM
Wow, I guess since you lost all credibility with Matt you should probably stop writing this column.
Posted By: Lucky (Guest) on September 18, 2009 at 02:14 PM
I think it's reasonable to expect someone that is writing a column on movies to have seen a lot more well respected films then the author of this column appears to have seen. This has more of a feel of a personal blog. Then again a news site that focuses more on pictures of stars then actual news shouldn't really expect anything else.
Posted By: Nero (Guest) on September 21, 2009 at 09:08 PM
Fuck the haters. The fact that BTTF 3 and Terminator 3 is on this list and Matrix Revolutions isn't is a fucking travesty.
Posted By: SeatsPro (Guest) on October 01, 2009 at 05:20 PM
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