Ask 411 Movies 11.07.11: Dancing with the Devil in the Pale Moonlight!

Posted by Leonard Hayhurst on 11.07.2011

What will happen to the Batman franchise after The Dark Knight Rises? Was Mel Gibson supposed to die at the end of Lethal Weapon 2? Does Blade Runner have the most different DVD versions? All this and more covered in Ask 411 Movies!


YouTube clip of the week
November is Thanksgiving, so we will be celebrating the great turkey all month. This week, the opening segments of Turkey TV



Leonard's favorite episode of Alice
Every week I highlight my favorite episode of a popular series. Alice was based on the Martin Scorsese film Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore. Even though the show was centered around a diner in Phoenix, various celebrities playing themselves showed up from time to time, such as Jerry Reed and Art Carney. I believe the first to show up was George Burns in "Oh, George Burns" in season two. Burns is in Phoenix and eats at Mel's Diner. Ditzy Vera believes George Burns really is God, as he played in the hit movie Oh, God. Vera goes to Burns' hotel room and wants to follow him as a disciple. Alice and Burns then have to convince Vera he's really not God, but Vera does such a good job of outsmarting him even Burns begins to think he's God himself. The best bit is when Burns points to the monogrammed GB on his shirt and asks Vera if God would wear somebody else's clothes. Vera's explanation, GB stands for "God Bless."



Mystery actor/actress of the week
Every week I'll give clues to a mystery actor or actress. If you think you know who it is, post in the comments. You win nothing but a tip of the top hat from me, but isn't that enough?

Last week: I appeared in a movie with last week's mystery actor, Martin Sheen, in another film written, directed and featuring his son Emilio Estevez. My father is an FBI agent and my mother is a schoolteacher. They wouldn't let me take the lead in Heathers because they thought the language was too risqué. Later I would go onto play a stripper and a porn star in two big movies. Due to my role choices, I'm estranged from my parents. However, I am a public advocate for Children International and my last released film had me as a ditzy aunt in a family film. In 1986 I competed on Scrabble during teen week. Who am I?



The answer is Heather Graham. She played a stripper in The Hangover and a porn star in Boogie Nights. Her last movie released over the summer was Judy Moody and the Not Bummer Summer. The movie she did with Martin Sheen was Bobby.

This week's mystery actress: Last week's mystery actress, Heather Graham, made her uncredited feature film debut in a movie which I played the title character. I won a best actress Oscar in another movie where I played the title character. That character had the same last name as my real last name and her first name was my nickname. This was done intentionally by my then boyfriend, who was the director, writer and male lead of the movie. The next time I was nominated for a best actress Oscar it was again for a movie in which my boyfriend, this time a different one, wrote, directed and starred. I also dated another famous costar from a successful film trilogy. I've never married, but do have two adopted children. A career driven single woman who winds up with a baby she originally didn't want was the plot of one of my movies. Who am I?

I complained that I didn't have many questions to answer last week and you guys came through this week. I've got so many some are on hold until next week. So hold your horses, all will be answered in due time. Unless you ask me about a movie I haven't watched. You've got a better chance of being Kim Kardashian's next ex-husband. Ha, topical humor.

Q: Great column as usual, Leonard....although I'm slightly disappointed you never mentioned "Sorority Babes in the Slimeball Bowl-O-Rama" in your list of oddball horror films. After all, if it's based on "The Monkey's Paw" it's gotta be good, right? And in addition to Peter Criss' problems on "Kiss Meets the Phantom of the Park", Ace Frehley had chemical and behavioral issues on set, to the point where his stand in (an African-American in the spaceman makeup and costume) can easily be spotted in his few scenes.

My question is, which movies have been released the most times on DVD? I know multiple versions of "Blade Runner" have been released over the last 30 years, but there have to be others I'm just not thinking of.
-jvq1

A: Thanks for the further information on Kiss Meets the Phantom of the Park from last week. I knew that, but forgot to include.
Sorority Babes in the Slimeball Bowl-O-Rama from 1988 is supposed to be based on the classic short story "The Monkey's Paw" according to Wikipedia and IMDB. It stars scream queens Linnea Quigley, Brinke Stevens and Michelle Bauer. The movie got a limited release, but gained a cult following thanks to late night cable airings, particularly on USA Up All Night. Three nerds spy on some sorority girls taking showers and getting spanked for initiation. They get caught and are forced to go with the girls to a bowling alley to steal a trophy. This is where it goes from kinky to weird. Inside the trophy is an evil imp who causes all hell to break loose.



According to Wikipedia there are seven different versions of Blade Runner; the work print shown to test audiences, the a sneak peak preview shown in San Diego in May 1982, the theatrical release, the international cut, the broadcast television version, the director's cut and what is known as the final cut. The final cut represents Ridley Scott's complete vision of what he wanted to do with the movie, even more so than the director's cut, which Michael Arick put together through notes from Scott.

According to Amazon, DVDs out there include the five-disc complete collector's edition in regular DVD, HD DVD and blu-ray, the director's cut, the final cut on regular DVD and blu-ray, the two-disc final cut, the theatrical version, the five-disc ultimate collector's edition in regular DVD, blu-ray and HD DVD, the director's cut re-mastered limited edition and the limited edition collector's set. So 14 different DVDs.



Working with my friend Ron Adams at Creepy Classics, I know the movies that are going to have the most DVD releases are the ones in public domain. You don't have to pay anyone for the rights to make and distribute a DVD for it, so multiple companies can put out the same movie and it's pretty much pure profit for them without any royalties to pay.

I guessed the one he had the most copies of is House on Haunted Hill. There appears to be about 12 different DVDs of it out there and it's all the same movie, not different versions like with Blade Runner.



Q: What other actors are known to be completely oblivious to their status? Who's the least self aware star?
-Letterstein

A: It was mentioned last week that Kirstie Alley had said in interviews that John Travolta had no concept he had dropped off the A-list while they were doing the Look Who's Talking series.

Again referencing my friend Ron Adams, I go to a lot of autograph shows and movie conventions with him and run into a lot of has-been stars who seem to have an inflated sense of worth just based on what they charge for an autograph. Although I've heard some people charging outrageous prices to just sign their name, the highest I've ever seen in person was Adam West. He was charging $60 a piece. This was at the Steel-City Toy Con last December. The average I see at most shows is $20 to $25 with most letting you get a picture if you pay for an autograph, but I've seen some people charge separate for a photo with them. My friend Bob Pelligrino likes to tell a story about how Robert Vaughn once cut to the front of a buffet line Ron and he were in, because…well, it seemed to be because he thought being Robert Vaughn let you do that.



This is an interesting site I found about how well celebrities tip. I think that can probably tell you a lot about their ego and who they think they are. A few mentioned on the list who I've heard or read other places have an over inflated sense of their own star power and worth are Richard Dreyfuss, Sharon Stone, David Keith and Don Henley. When I went to New York in high school I met this woman who was working at FAO Schwartz and got talking with her. She said she used to work in the café of a local gym that a lot of celebrities went into. She said Harrison Ford never tipped and was always rude.

It seems like a lot of the really good tippers are the old school guys like Joe Pesci, Burt Reynolds (although my guess is that he still thinks he's A-list), Dennis Farina and Frank Sinatra Jr. I've read several times that Sinatra Sr. was the greatest tipper who ever lived. He used to walk across a casino floor and shake hands with various dealers, servers and supervisors and when they pulled their hand away a $100 bill would be in it.



Q: AMC's Halloween marathon this past weekend led to this question: They aired Halloween 1, 3-5, and Halloween H20. I understand skipping 6 and everything after H20 since they suck, but why skip Halloween 2? Theoretically, the rights are owned by the same people/company as the rest of the Halloween movies they aired, so why not get the rights to that movie along with the others?
-Guest 0350

A: I couldn't find a definitive answer, but I found some possible answers. Halloween II was being shown on Cinemax in October, so it's possible the channel had the rights tied up. The blu-ray edition of Halloween II came out in September as a 30th anniversary edition, so Universal didn't want to have it on basic cable and possibly take away from sells. Although AMC has shown it in the past, the television edit of the movie has several changes for content from the theatrical version and it could be a combination of AMC or Universal not wanting to show the heavily edited version anymore.



Q: With AMC airing their annual Halloween movies I have a question about a couple actors.

Bela Legosi, Boris Karloff and Lon Chaney Jr. seemed to take almost any role that was asked of them without discretion. Why would three actors who had such high points in their respective careers have to resort to acting in any movie they had been handed a script for? Was it bad management? Personal demons?

Also thinking of the Universal Horror classics, what was the budget for something like a Frankenstien? Where the actors then contracted to do more movies?
Thank you,
-Shaun

A: After Dracula Universal Studios wanted Bela Lugosi to play the monster in Frankenstein. As reports have it, Lugosi didn't like the script, because it was all grunting for him, and didn't like the makeup. Of course, the script and makeup and overall concept of the film changed before it actually made it to the screen. The part went to Boris Karloff, a bit player at the time with Universal, and made him not only a big star, but Lugosi's chief rival at the studio. Lugosi's actual follow-up to Dracula, Murders in the Rue Morgue didn't do well at the box office at all. Lugosi was relegated to B-movies, while Karloff got the A-movie roles. Lugosi was also typecast by his accent, European looks and age, he was already over 50 when Dracula hit. So, with Lugosi it's usually said he took whatever movie came along because he didn't want another Frankenstein scenario and he also needed the money because he wasn't working as much as he would like.



For Karloff, he just liked being a working actor and took what was offered to him without any thought as to the quality of the project. He would put in his usual strong performance, enjoy the experience as best he could and move on. Even up to his death at the age of 81 in 1969, Karloff was still frequently on radio and stage and in movies and television shows.



With Lon Chaney Jr., it was most likely alcohol that derailed his career. In an infamous live episode of Tales of Tomorrow in 1958, he showed up drunk and thought they were doing a rehearsal and not the actual episode. He was playing the Frankenstein Monster and would pick up furniture he was supposed to smash and then sit it back down, while muttering to himself. Chaney always worked steady and was still doing notable films into the 1960s, like Welcome to Hard Times with Henry Fonda in 1967. So, it was a mix of things with Chaney. He liked to work, he took the work available and alcohol and smoking did damage his health and sapped his bank account, if not so much damaged his reputation.



According to IMDB, the estimated budget for Frankenstein was $291,000, Dracula was $355,000, The Wolfman was $140,000, The Mummy was $80,000 and Abbott and Costello Meet Frankenstein was $800,000 to give you some examples. Universal was always lower than the other big studios and being able to produce horror films fairly on the cheap in the 1930s and 1940s basically kept the studio afloat.

Back in the golden age of Hollywood, actors weren't free agents. They were contracted to a certain studio. That's why you frequently see the same actors in the movies made by the same studios. Studios would often swap actors, maybe MGM would give Joan Crawford to Paramount for a melodrama if they could get Bing Crosby for a musical. So, it wasn't like today when actors sign a multiple picture deal for something that is intended to be a franchise. If Universal wanted to make another Frankenstein movie they still had everyone they needed unless that person was fired, bought out their contract, left at the end of their studio contract or were tied up on another project. Actors did have some say over what films they did, but if a studio really wanted them in something, they usually did it. Guys like Lugosi were on limited contracts later in their careers, so it wasn't like they signed up for five years, but for one or two films at a time.

Q: TCM just finished their month-long salute to Buster Keaton, and it raised a few questions.

1) During his shorts with Fatty Arbuckle, a guy named Al St. John wss typically featured as a third banana. He seemed to be a very talented physical comedian, but I've never heard of him before, and was wondering whatever happened to him?

2) Buster's solo shorts usually had Joe Roberts as his main antagonist. Could you give some information on him?

3) What's your favourite Buster Keaton short or feature?

4) Keaton or Chaplin?
-Vince

A: Al St. John was born Sept. 10, 1893 in Santa Ana, Calif., and he died at the age of 69 in 1963. St. John was Fatty Arbuckle's nephew and that's how he got into silent films around 1912. When Arbuckle formed his own production company, St. John went with him and did the movies you saw with him, Arbuckle and Buster Keaton. After Arbuckle was rocked by a scandal (he supposedly raped Virginia Rappe and caused her death. He was cleared of all charges after three trials, but the damage was done to his career), Arbuckle went secretly behind the camera and directed St. John as a lead in several films.

In 1937, he went to Producers Releasing Corporation and played the western sidekick Fuzzy Q. Jones in a series of pictures. The character was so popular overseas that movies released in Germany had Fuzzy's name in the title instead of whomever the starring cowboy character was. St. John played Jones in about 80 movies, with the last being in 1952. From then until his death he made personal appearances at rodeos and fairs and worked some for the Tommy Scott Wild West Show.



Joe Roberts was born Feb. 2, 1871, and died in 1923 at the age of 52. He toured the vaudeville circuit in a physical comedy act with his wife. In the summers they would stay at an actors colony in Michigan ran by the Keaton family and that's how Roberts met Buster Keaton. When Keaton finished working with Arbuckle in 1920 and started doing his own shorts he asked Roberts to work with him. Keaton knew that the contrast in their size and looks would make Roberts a good villainous foil for him. While making Our Hospitality with Keaton in 1923, Roberts suffered a small stroke. He insisted on finishing the movie and died of a second stroke shortly after its completion.



I can't say that I've seen a lot of Buster Keaton and I'm sorry I missed most of what TCM showed of his in October. Mostly I've seen the seminal stuff he made toward the end of the silent era like The General, College, Sherlock Jr. and Steamboat Bill Jr., which are all very good and I think would be good starting points for anyone wanting to get into Keaton. I personally prefer Charlie Chaplin, who I think was a more innovative and accomplished filmmaker than Keaton. Keaton wanted to make people laugh, but Chaplin wanted to make people think. Films like The Great Dictator, City Lights, The Gold Rush and Modern Times I consider essential viewing.



Q: I probably should have asked this during Halloween, but just how many series has Scooby Doo been in? Also, why is some of the gang (meaning Fred, Daphne, and Velma) excluded from some of them?
-JLAJRC

A: There have been 11 different Scooby-Doo series, barring some name changes of ongoing series. Fred, Velma and Daphne were dropped from some incarnations to basically mix thing up and to save on animation and writing when pennies were being pinched.

Scooby-Doo, Where Are You! ran two seasons of 25 episodes from 1969 to 1970. In the late 1960s several parent groups protested violent Saturday morning cartoons. Hanna-Barbera and CBS wanted to create an action oriented show that would be more family friendly. The original idea for the series was called Mysteries Five and would have been about a traveling rock band of teens, similar to the Archies, who go around solving crimes. Characters changed, the band idea was scrapped and Scooby-Doo and the gang as we know them came about.



The New Scooby-Doo Movies ran two seasons of 60-minute episodes from 1972 to 1973. The gang would team up with real life celebrities like Don Knotts, Jonathan Winters and Sandy Duncan and characters from other Hanna-Barbera shows like Speed Buggy to solve crimes.



The Scooby-Doo Show ran three seasons of 40 episodes on ABC from 1976 to 1978. The first season was part of an hour long package with Dynomutt. Dynomutt was the robotic sidekick of superhero the Blue Falcon and they even teamed up with the Scooby gang. The second season was part of Scooby-Doo's Laff A-Lympics. Scooby was the captain of a team of Hanna-Barbera's mystery show characters. Yogi Bear was the captain of a team of animal characters. Mutley was the captain of a team of villains. They competed in various contests and athletic sports. The final season was a two hour block of programming featuring Scooby-Doo, Laff-A-Lympics, Dynomutt and Captain Caveman and the Teen Angels.



Scooby-Doo and Scrappy-Doo ran four seasons of 49 episodes from 1979 to 1982. It was decided that the Scooby-Doo formula was growing stale and ratings were declining. Scooby's nephew Scrappy was added. In 1980 and 1981 Scooby was packaged with Richie Rich. The hour show featured three seven minute segments each of Richie Rich and Scooby-Doo. Because episodes were cut down to shorts Fred, Velma and Daphne were cut to save time and animation. The three had become marginal with the addition of Scrappy anyway. In 1983 the series became The Scooby and Scrappy Doo Puppy Power Hour. Along with the Scooby and Scrappy shorts were Scrappy teaming with his other uncle, Yabba-Doo who belonged to a wild west sheriff, and The Puppy's New Adventures spun-off from the 1978 Ruby-Spears special The Puppy Who Wanted a Boy



The New Scooby-Doo Mysteries ran two seasons from 1983 to 1984 of 26 episodes. It was known as The All-New Scooby and Scrappy Doo Show in the first season. The idea was to do a show closer to the original series with the Scrappy character involved. The shows were two 11-minute episodes. With the longer running time it was decided to bring back one character to serve as the brains of the outfit with Daphne considered as the most colorful and most interesting when compared to nerdy Velma and pompous Fred. Fred and Velma did have guest spots in the second season.



Ratings were on the decline again and it was decided to do a major overhaul of the Scooby formula. The 13 Ghosts of Scooby-Doo ran one season of 13 episodes in 1985. Scooby and Shaggy accidentally release 13 of the nastiest ghouls ever out of the Demon Chest to roam the earth. Since they let them out, they have to put them back in. Assisting along with Daphne and Scrappy, were kid conman Flim-Flam and wizard Vincent Van Ghoul, voiced by Vincent Price.



Reruns of previous Scooby incarnations ran until 1988 when A Pup Named Scooby-Doo debuted. It ran until 1991 with 27 episodes. It was popular at the time to take old characters and reduce them to children. We find the Scooby gang as tweens growing up in Coolsville in what can be considered as the early 1960s, to go with them being late teens to early 20s when the original series ran.



Scooby-Doo then pretty much laid dormant outside of the occasional animated film or special until the late 1990s when reruns on Boomerang and the Cartoon Network revitalized the character. Four direct to DVD movies were released between 1998 and 2001. A feature film followed in 2002 with a sequel in 2004. This all led to the new series What's New Scooby-Doo?, which ran three seasons of 42 episodes. This returned to the original show format with the original Scooby gang. The show was set in the current era and was more realistic and less comical than some past incarnations.



Shaggy and Scooby-Doo Get a Clue ran two seasons of 26 episodes from 2006 to 2008 on the Kids WB. Shaggy's rich uncle has gone missing and Shaggy is heir to the estate. He uses the money to update the Mystery Machine, which can now turn into other vehicles and machines. Nano technology created by Shaggy's uncle are now part of the Scooby Snacks while has odd side effects. Scooby and Shaggy are aided by a robot butler to fight the evil Phineas Phibes. Fred, Daphne and Velma have a couple cameos, but this was again another try at revamping the basic formula by changing up characters, plot and animation style.



Scooby Doo! Mystery Incorporated is the current incarnation that so far has run two seasons of 52 episodes since 2010. This is a reboot of the entire Scooby mythos. The animation has a retro style, but returns to similar character looks from the original series. Also, different character and story arcs extend from episode to episode.



Q: What happened to Saturday morning cartoons? When I was a kid (born in 1979) Saturday had the best cartoons, and they ran from early morning until about Noon. Now it seems like the cartoons not only suck (my subjective opinion, I know), but are only on for a few hours due to other programming. What caused this change? Also, when did Saturday morning/afternoon syndicated wrestling shows go out of style?
-Guest 2504

A: Saturday morning cartoons started becoming popular in the 1960s when networks figured out they could target children with advertising and studios like Hanna-Barbera and Filmation began making what was known as limited animation shows, which were cheap to produce. These series used less frames per second than animated features and shorts. In fact, the rise of animated television series led to the death of animated theatrical shorts.

The Saturday morning concept peaked in the 1980s and petered out from there for several reasons. One was the proliferation of syndication and cable networks, which saturated the market. Animated shows just weren't seen on Saturday mornings, but Sunday mornings, weekdays before kids went to school and in the afternoons when they came home. You also had VHS and later DVD and later still the internet offering more avenues for shows to be watched.

As mentioned above, parents groups in the 1960s began protesting the proliferation of violence, commercialism, stereotypes and anti-social attitudes of Saturday morning cartoons. This led to more regulation of series, limiting series creativity, forcing educational elements into the shows and limiting advertising. It became more difficult and more expensive to make the series while revenue from advertisers decreased. This didn't cover live action programs and thanks to the popularity of NBC's Saved by the Bell there was a huge shift to live action shows in the 1990s.

In the mid-1990s the Federal Communications Commission instilled new regulations that networks had to air at least three hours of educational or informational programming for children every week. This led to weekend editions of the morning network news programs and other educational shows, like Bill Nye the Science Guy taking over the children's hours on Saturdays. In recent years, more cartoons have returned to Saturday mornings, like on the CW and CBS. Just this past September, ABC stopped airing Disney programs it did have in favor of the Litton's Weekend Adventures, which satisfies the FCC E/I requirements.



Q: I just watched Batman: Year One, and in my mind, now more than ever, I believe the spectacular Mr. Cranston should have played Commissioner Gordon in the Nolanverse Batman films. Was he ever even mentioned on the rumor list, or is Nolan's weakness of casting people he's already worked with before pretty much set in stone by then?
-Cactus

A: According to IMDB, those considered to play James Gordon in Batman Begins were Chris Cooper, Dennis Quaid and Kurt Russell. The part eventually went to Gary Oldman. While Director Christopher Nolan does have a habit of using the same actors over and over again, the Batman franchise are the only films he's made to date with Oldman. I don't see this as a bad trait as many directors often use the same actors over and over again because they like working with them and know what they can get out of them. Just look at Martin Scorsese with the likes of Leonardo DiCaprio and Robert DeNiro.

Bryan Cranston was not considered for the role of Gordon from what I can find and I doubt he would have been. You have to remember that when the 2005 released Batman Begins was being cast Cranston was still best known for his role as bumbling, but lovable dad Hal on Malcolm in the Middle. While he might seem like a good and perhaps obvious choice now, he wasn't then thanks to his then star power and typecasting.



Q: Not so much a clear answer to this question but more of your opinion. What do you think happens to the Batman movies after Nolan is done with the third one? I have heard rumors of a possible tv show or just rebooting the movies again which I think would be a bad choice. Personally, I would get a a new cast (if the actors didn't want to come back) and just continue it like they do with the Bond series.
-Jay

A: Warner Bros. and DC Comics have not said definitely what they will do with the Batman character once The Dark Knight Rises is released. It's being considered that this will be director Christopher Nolan's last Batman film, but that hasn't been set in concrete. Nor has if lead Christian Bale and other cast members would return if Nolan wasn't involved in future films. Originally, Nolan didn't want to make a third movie, but after he worked on a script with his brother, Jonathan, and David S. Goyer, Nolan felt they had come up with a satisfactory way to end his version of the Batman world and characters. Still that doesn't mean enough money and coming up with another good script couldn't entice Nolan back.

I think Warners and DC will get through this movie before they decide what they want to do next. In my opinion they shouldn't rush to reboot the franchise another time or doing a live action television series because of how successful, how stylized and how popular with fans the Nolan films have been. You never want to be the guy that follows the guy and I think the laws of probability says the next Batman entity will probably not be considered as good or be as popular if enough time hasn't past. Animated series can work and perhaps a completely different take on the character, like adapting Frank Miller's The Dark Knight Returns about an aged Batman in a socially devolved world.

Currently the only other DC movie filming is Man of Steel. DC and Warners have been wanting to develop other DC characters based on the success Marvel has been having lately. This led to Green Lantern this past year, which underperformed expectations, and Jonah Hex last year that flopped. There has been talks of doing other movies or television shows based on the Flash, Hawkman, Aquaman, Green Arrow and others. A Justice League of America show or movie has been talked about, but has stalled as DC doesn't want to commit major characters like Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman and Green Lantern to the films because of other possible solo projects for those characters. Goyer and Justin Marks have written a script that has done several rounds in Hollywood called Super Max. Green Arrow is framed for a crime he didn't commit and is sent to a jail filled with rogue superheroes and low tier villains that he must escape from. Icicle was to be one of the main villains. The Joker, Riddler and Lex Luthor were to have cameos, which was one thing DC and Warners balked at.



Q: Is it true that Mel Gibson's character, Martin Riggs, was supposed to die at the end of Lethal Weapon 2 but they redid the ending?
-Leo

A: According to IMDB, screenwriter Shane Black wanted to have Martin Riggs die on the boat after being shot three times. Warner Bros. producers refused that as they saw the potential to make more movies. Black left the project and Jeffrey Boam, who also wrote the third film, did the actual screenplay from a story by Black and Warren Murphy. As Murphy tells it, he was hired to work with Black and the two didn't get along too well. So they turned in a script draft, took a story credit for their efforts and split from there.



Don't die.
"It's too bad we had to kill her. I really liked the outfit she had on."