The Mosh Pit 8.22.08: Axl Rose

Posted by Dan Haggerty on 08.22.2008

This week the Mosh Pit takes on the enigma that is Axl Rose and what we can expect from Chinese Democracy, to ask what the truth is at the center of the wait and hype. Plus it’s week four of our look at Metallica’s catalogue. Check out the full article!




Rock on everyone ,and welcome to another edition of the Friday column that hits you with op-eds and metal. Before moving on I wanted to address the great feedback from some of you that visited the pit last week. While I focused on one aspect of the jam, people got the greater message and offer up thoughts on the whole shebang, which was very cool.

• Thanks Luke for the heads up. I picked up that Led Zeppelin CD based on your recommendation, already having passed it a few times. In fact, I'm enjoying it as I write this. So thanks man!

• Dan Halen, always being my musical conscious on the classics. You nailed the real point I skimmed, wanting to focus on the solo/instrumental side of things. Some good recommendations as well. Including one I don't have – the Allman Brothers. Yes – It's true. I'll need to rectify that some time…

• And Justice For All… is the dark horse of the catalog. Being the sleeper favorite of many fans, and an album that just grows and holds up over time.

• I dropped the Milli Vannili reference just for you Brandon. Ha!

• Ben. Don't make me drive down there!

• Stephanie had a lot of good points, and she nailed the discussion on the direction of music and its relationship to instrumentals, solos, and the jam. She, like Luke above, also recommended Blind Faith, so I have to admit now I'm curious. While I agree that radio formats are prohibitive to such a concept, the thing to remember is that they were also that way back then as well. The labels tried to get Queen to change "Bohemian Rhapsody" originally due to its length. Good thing they didn't! And there are many more examples to add that. So while the industry always tries to shoe horn the bands into a format, persistence to ones principles does pay off. I honestly believed if someone wanted to do it, they could. But that might just be the optimist in me. And finally, I envy you're greater access to the Chicago music scene! I love visiting there for that reason. Make sure you visit Metal Haven for me - I enter a state of Euphoria when I go in there.

• Thanks for the idea's "Some Random dude!"

• And I will continue to trash the pox that was hair metal. Sure, there were some good bands, and even some bad bands that did some good songs. But at the end of the day a lot of good bands, metal or glam, got buried under the wave of perfumed pop. And for that, I'll gladly take shots at it. Although, I have to admit, a column based around some of the good glam stuff would be interesting and fun.

Thanks for writing in everyone. Long live the Jam!


Axl Rose and Chinese Democracy

After a recent Fact or Fiction, I received a great email from a reader named Robert. He wanted to put his to discuss Axl Rose, Guns N' Roses, and Chinese Democracy. And he made some really good points, points we haven't actually been made, and I suppose that is natural since his was the perspective of a fan who hopes Axl can overcome all the drama and actually get an album out that reaches its full potential, while the staff here has been barraged with stories about the whole mess for, well years, and is obviously more jaded and tired of the whole thing. And I have to admit, I'm guilty of that as well. Axl Rose and Chinese Democracy falling into that lovely area of people I can always count on to give me a good Fact or Fiction question, otherwise just a fodder for a toss off joke. And that is the real crime here, because before all the laughs and the band's drama was a power house of a group that made a big statement.

But really, when it comes down to it, the fun we have ripping into Axl – Be it the album that never happens or any other drama – has nothing to do with what we might actually get musically. Even I, who make a habit of treating Gene Simmons^TM or Bono as the asshats they are, still think they have (and still can release) good music. Although for Bono, it better be pretty damn good; but that's me. Don't get me started! Overall, you need to separate the man from the music or at least try. As I just self admitted, overall this is easier for some than for others, and it depends on the artists/group, what he does that bothers you, and if it's something you can get past. For most people, with most musicians this shouldn't be a problem. I mean, if I actually let people's opinions or actions/life on every little thing influence my opinion of their music, my CD rack would be very small. And as the beautiful and fabulous Mrs. Haggerty can attest, that is far from the case.

And I suspect that most people are like this, and even though we rip into people like Axl for taking 14 years to release a CD, ultimately it is nothing that really morally offends people when looking at the man's output. It's a running joke, but not anything that impinges the man's music itself.

So with a clear eye for then and now, we're going to take a look at the good and bad of the man and the band, and see if we can actually make sense of the jokes, the jabs, the drama, and the urban legends, to see if we can make a statement on the truth.

As with all things, we need to start at the beginning. Not only does it provide a good base to work off of by shinning a light on the foundation of what we think today, but more importantly not everyone knows or forgets what was. And really, that is an important part of the story. Plus, as much as it becomes increasingly painful to admit, more and more people weren't there…

Part of understanding the huge success of GNR goes back to knowing when they were huge. In this case, it was the end of the 80's. Sleaze rock, as it is technically called now, was the Sunset Strip bands of the early part of that decade; early Motley Crue (pre-Theatre of Pain), Ratt, Quiet Riot, those kind of bands. Basically hard rock partying its ass of at a biker bar in LA. And this music scene and the resulting style of sound took off big time. By the mid-80's, it was the mainstream and labels were rushing to sign anything that had a guitar and played in a nightclub.

But that music scene was evolving with the image of MTV and the insurgence of glam with a marketing age make-over. This would evolve into the pop metal scene and more specifically the hair bands; think later 80's Motley Crue, Poison, and that kind of thing. While hair "metal" rode the early success of the sleaze bands, and turned in into a pop formula that did quite well, the gold rush of labels pushing a gazillion copy-cat bands down the population's throats with simpler pop hooks and dumber lyrics eventually burned the whole scene out. Tweens grow up, and the next batch move on to something new that is not the status quo.

So here we are, in the later part of the 80's. We have a million bands overdosing on hair spray and their girlfriend's make-up, and little left of that original down and dirty sleaze street level hard rock that caused the gold rush in the first place.

That's when Appetite for Destruction came out. Everyone took notice, because not only was it musically a good album, but more importantly it was in many ways a return to form of a music scene. It was a fresh breath of air, or perhaps a shot of the original air is a better term. Anyway, it was all the things people liked but lost in the predominant music trends. No pretty boys here, just the dudes rocking out with all the menace of street brawlers. Bret Michaels wanted you to skinny-bop, while Slash welcomed you to the jungle. Bon Jovi said love was bad medicine, but Axl danced with Mr. Brownstone. I mean, it's easy to see who had the look and edge at that point!

15 million units sold later and it is one of the biggest debut albums of all time.

Never underestimate the power of an idea. Part of Led Zeppelin's enduring legacy and impact is solely based on the idea of the band itself. And trust me, I like Led Zeppelin, but I have no illusion that the idea of Led Zeppelin and what they represented was more important than their music. Their music was important, but the idea of it mixed with the band itself became so much more. I'll have to write about that at a future date.

Anyway, Guns N' Roses also represented an idea. It was a return to the dangerous edges of society. It was street level. It wasn't glitzy or poppy, but down and dirty. But there is also a meticulous production and attention to detail that those earlier albums from the Strip did not have. At the time, but less since, I always thought that this represented just a too convenient coincidence; a deliberate attempt to engineer the best of both worlds. But as time passes and the more I hear and learn about Rose, I'm more inclined to believe it was just his almost inhuman attention to perfection in details. So what we got was a great album that for all intent and purposes represented the place where those early bands should have gone, but didn't for the purgatory of perfume and MTV play. They were selling out, and anyone could tell you that. But GNR represented the opposite that. The idea was even more popular than the obvious high budget attention to detail, and it was HUGE.

As a complete aside, and more of a commentary, I wonder if it has ever occurred to anyone that that idea into itself made Guns N' Roses the forward warning shot in the eventual Grunge revolution. Now I'm NOT saying GNR begot grunge. Hardly. What I'm saying that the fact the band's back to the street look and hard edges was a precursor to the image that grunge would succeed on. Grunge just took it all the way to its natural conclusion. Like I said, we're talking about the idea of the band, and not necessarily their music as a whole. If the labels would learn to run their business as a real forward thinking business, they might have caught that.

Now I need to comment on the music. Especially before the fans get some rope… None of the above is to discredit the bands music. Not at all. The idea, or image, of the band is precisely built on their music. Glam is simply hooky rhythms under a glass pop sheen, with lots of flamboyance and pomp. The only real different between ABBA and Poison is one had talented singers, less hair, and wore mini-skirts. Guns N' Roses stormed the gates and trashed that pop style.

I would like to apologize to ABBA for that last crack. They deserve better than that.

Slash raped the easy sounds of the current music scene precisely because he sat there in that hat looking like a wild carnivore then delivered the meaty hooks and rhythms to back it up. People ate up the entire package. So whether you like the band or not, or enjoy what the various members have done since that time, the bottom line is a lot of people would beg to differ. I myself have never been a big fan of Axl's vocal style. Some songs work for me, and others do not. But I'm more than aware that I exist in the minority on that.

As surely as the band hit with a tremendous impact, the band never got to its next full release without the drama starting. First up are the drugs and drinking; its little secret that there were a lot of drugs and alcohol flowing through the band. In fact, it became quite common knowledge that Duff, Slash, Izzy and Adler were often intoxicated; and not always on stage, but at events or in front of the press. After Slash and McKagan showed up to the American Music Awards in 90 drunk and swearing (on stage!), Axl actually threatened to shut the band down if they didn't straighten out.

Now think about that for a minute. No matter what you have heard about Axl Rose. You have got to admit that it is very telling when HE is the one trying to straighten out the band. By the time the Use Your Illusion sessions started, drummer Steven Adler was fired due to his heroin problem after the band had to do 30 takes due him screwing up. So here we Axl trying to keep the band going and on target.

But other incidents show a different side of Rose. During the same sessions, he refused to finish the album until band manager Alan Niven and replaced. That is a pretty extreme method of forcing change! Also, during the following tour Rose became legendary for ranting on stage, showing up late, and even going off on security. This all lead to the famous Riverport riot where at a show outside St. Louis a riot broke out when Axl jumped into the audience and tackled someone recording the show. After being pulled off, Rose gave a rant on security, slammed the mike down and walked of the stage. Slash tried to calm the audience, who thought the mike slamming was a gun shot, before announcing the show was over. The crowd turned violent and rioted.

And what's even more amazing is that this incident almost repeated itself in Germany later that year!

If you want to be positive, you can look at the man as a perfectionist who demands, and gets premium quality. You need to look no further that the incredible sales of the bands catalogue and how advid fans still are of the band. Under this theory, he drove people away and caused friction but it was worth the journey when you hold that up against the final output of the band. If you want to be negative, you can see the man as a demanding ogre who pissed of fans live, and drove band members so far to distraction that you could blame him for helping splinter one of the hugest bands of it's time. And let's face it, a band is ultimately chemically balanced in how they work together, and changing members changes that. Usually not for the better.

And yes, before someone says something, I know Rose was not responsible for every member leaving. Izzy Stradlin quit after the Germany incident partially due to the issues with Rose, but also due to conflicts with Slash ironically brought on due to his sobriety.

And all of this doesn't even touch the riot in 92 in Montreal when they performed after Metallica!

So you can look at Axl as a Howard Hughes type, whose idiosyncrasies can be enigmatic and distracting, but ultimately brilliant to the point what he touches turns to gold. Or you can look at him as an egotistical maniac who manages to produce popular music but destroys and salts the earth to get there.

Another aside – Am I the only the person a bit horrified in how Hollywood treats Howard Hughes? I mean, I know the guy had his issues, and he went to hell near the end of his life. But good Lord, would it kill them to point out all the massive wealth and industries the man gave us. The fact that we wouldn't have modern commercial aviation without him is staggering into itself.

So the point is, you can really see Axl in two ways, and while I have laid it down to the extremes, people are going to fall into one of the two general categories in their opinion.

Next is the fact that, no matter how you view the band or Axl from 20 years ago, the bottom line is that todays Guns N' Roses is Axl Rose, and only Axl Rose. There are no original members and only one dude from Illusion. This is, for all intent and purposes, an Axl solo album.

But with that being said, I also need to point out that this "solo" album so far sounds incredibly like GNR. Axl is like Ozzy in the sense that he knows how to surround himself with some damn good musicians, and when you mix that with the fact Axl is writing this stuff, along with his meticulous attention to detail, you know your going to get a band that sounds exactly like whatever Rose wants them to. Axl drove everyone to distraction partially to get a particular sound, and he's going to be just a studious now. So while this isn't going to be the same Guns N' Roses as two decades ago, it's going to be very close in style. In fact, since there aren't the drug problems or personality meltdowns going on, it'll likely be closer to Appetite that Illusion. Mind you, it won't be the same, and we'll have to wait and see if it will be as good in song quality, but in sound style my money is giving odds that it will be similar – Just updated with modern production standards and equipment.

And that leads into the final point, and it is something people who know me and read my column will know, and that is the enigma that is production. I'm always thinking about production, since I'm a firm believer that it can make, break, and even kill an album. My real fear for this album is that with all of the time, attention to detail the man is known for, and the money he's been able to shove at this thing, there is going to be so much production and engineering this thing could be DOA on arrival.

We know the Axl is capable of writing great music. We know he has some great musicians. And the leaks have run the gamut from great to me, at least in my opinion. But even the writing is great, or even just does a decent job of it, he's got the musicians to nail it out of the park. Mind you, it won't have the same impact as the first time the world saw Slash slamming down that riff to "Welcome to the Jungle" on MTV, but the band is going to be all over this. But, the writing and playing won't matter if this thing gets analyzed, reworked, and tracked 20 ways from Sunday. Maybe he can keep that spark in it, or maybe he'll crush the life out of it. I don't know. But 14 years to work on it makes you wonder, that is for sure.

And that ultimately gets back to that idea of the band I began this with. The raw, street level energy that was the sound and idea of Guns N' Roses is what Axl needs to capture more than anything else for this to be a success. Production and polish can file off the edges and the energy that was the very cornerstone of what made GNR… Well GNR!

What are we going to get?

Ask 20 people, and you'll likely get 20 answers. After all, like all music it rides a base of personal opinion. If you like GNR, you're going to hold out hope for a good album. If you don't, then everything is just confirmation of your opinion. Many are just waiting to see, even if we're having some fun along the way. A decade plus to get here doesn't help the matter for anyone, and the final output will be the testimony if we'll forgive the mess. In fact, GNR fans have been waiting longer for this album, since the band hasn't actually put out a full album of new material since Illusion back in late 91!

It seems we're getting close, due to management activity and reports of business deals going down. At least I hope so. If anything, I think one thing everyone can agree with is that this album needs to get out, and it need to get out now. But hopefully, with this little bit of perspective, we can at least look at the likely options we'll get. We he's capable of and the reality of what might happen. You've gotten mine, and I'd love to hear yours.

Despite my critique of the Black Album, the fact is that is the bands biggest album. Metallica toured that thing for years, and became larger than life in the process. At this point the left the earthly realms of being masters of the metal underground, and embedded themselves into the psyche of pop culture and a mainstream force. For better or worse, depending on your view, Metallica changed with the times. And that leads us to part four…


Metallica Part 4: Commercial Metallica


Load





Release Date:June 4, 1996
Line Up: James Hetfield, Kirk Hammett, Lars Ulrich , and Jason Newsted.

Review: This was the moment the Metallica bandwagon got lighter, as many fans started bailing out the backdoor, heading for the hills and back to the metal underground to see bands that actually played metal. Metallica continuing down the road to a star-struck city called success, new hair-cuts, earrings, and even fur-coats as if to say "We were always Hollywood!"

That aside, what we are given is nothing more than hard rock album, albeit a good one. The metal has left the building, but the cries of alternative and such ring hollow. This is nothing more than blues infused hard rock with a few metal textures thrown in. If this would have been any other band, it would have been better received. But Metallica fans wanted "The Black Album II" while hardcore fans still waited in limbo for "Master of Puppets II", and they didn't get it. It would have been more palatable if the band would have said "We always wanted to do a blues/rock album and pay tribute to other bands". People would have forgiven that, but the sudden new look of the boys spoke volumes.

The good news is that in all honesty, this is at least more innovative than the self titled album, the band actually trying to pour some energy into these tracks versus borrowing from the past. "Ain't My Bitch" and "King Nothing" are fine dirty hard rockers, and "Bleeding Me" is a great song. The solo work on it is one of Hammett's best since Justice. In fact, it's the best soloing Hammett has done since then also. Even the ballads are better representations of what a ballad should be.

So you have one great song, some good tunes, and the rest is above average to filler range. Like I said, a good hard rock album, just totally unworthy of the potential this band had (or has).

The Mosh Pit Rating: 7.5/10



Reload





Release Date:November 18, 1997
Line Up: James Hetfield, Kirk Hammett, Lars Ulrich , and Jason Newsted. This would be the last official new album with Newsted, who departed in 2001.

Review: The dreaded B-Sides album. Well, actually such things are a lot of fun for fans of a band, and those who love to collect odds and ends from the artists they love. But the problem here is that this was treated more like a full release. A fact enforced thanks to the fact they released singles from it. Further, the "B-Sides" (can you really call them that in a world without 45's anyway?) are from only one recoding session: Load. I guess the Garage Days Re-Revisited handled the early stuff, even if they were covers. Then again, that EP craps on Metallica in the 90's from a great height, so who am I to argue about Metallica covers in the 80's.

The album is what it is, the second string stuff from Load; exactly what we didn't want. "Fuel" rocks hard and I have to believe it was new – Otherwise it's a shame it didn't make the last album. "Better than You" along with "Prince Charming" are pretty cool also, but everything starts were Load's filler tracks ended. I'm sure you may disagree with me on a few tracks, but the net result will be the same: One great track, a couple decent tracks, the rest is filler. Oh, and the ballad sucks. I said the ballads on Load were more innovative than the self-titled LP, not that they were that good, and certainly not worth another take that didn't make the first round. Hell, "The Unforgiven II" isn't even worth enough effort to get a real name.

The Mosh Pit Rating: 5/10




Garage Inc.





Review: All of the covers the band has done all lovingly re-wrapped into one compilation. Plus you get other rarities like the Motorhead covers, and that is one disc! Honestly, that disc alone makes this 2-CD set worth purchasing. Then again, "Am I Evil" is worth the price alone in my opinion – And I love the original Diamond Head version! But lets face it, all the covers the band did back in the 80's smoke.

Disc 2 is more hit or miss, with some songs not working (Seager and Lynyrd Skynyrd) while the Blue Oyster Cult and Thin Lizzy covers come fairly well. They go back to the Misfits and Diamond Head so the disc turns out well enough. I've rated it, but really it's more like Disc 1 is a 6.5 and Disc 2 is a 9.5

The Mosh Pit Rating: 8/10





S&M





Release Date:November 23, 1999
Line Up: James Hetfield, Kirk Hammett, Lars Ulrich , and Jason Newsted.

Review: The live album with the symphony. Great idea, average execution. As modern symphonic power metal groups show, this combo can work damn well. IF… and there always an "If" in these situations, "if" the music is designed upfront for the symphony. The problem with this album is that the classical instrumentation is just shoe-horned into the existing songs. The symphony spends half the record coming across as an odd background component to classic Metallica, and if seems pointless. More curiosity than "You got to check this out".

Some songs word well, like the opening Good, Bad, and Ugly classic "The Ecstasy of Gold" (Which was written for these instruments), and "Call Of Ktulu" surprisingly works great. I might just like that version as much as the original! "No Leaf Clover" was written for this recording, and to works along with the subtle re-write of "Hero Of The Day". Everything else fades into average and this just end up being background music. When this album works, it's great, otherwise it's average.

On a fun note, either the symphony is mixed poorly into the back, or the band was just that much louder at the show. Probably the former, but I can't shake the image of the classical players getting blown away by Metallica playing "Battery" live.

The Mosh Pit Rating: 6.5/10





That's it for Part Four. Next week we go for the final Part: The bucket full of what the fuck...

Final Thoughts

And that is a wrap. Grab a drink and have yourself a great weekend. Keep it real my friends, and always play it because you love it. Then crank it up to 10.