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 411mania » Politics » Blog Entry
The Redistribution of Wealth in America
Posted by Jason Douglas on 10.02.2009



My debut article was about Obama's health care speech, because it was not only a current event but a moment of potential historic significance. Since then I've sought to create a flow from one article to the next, rather than hopping from one somewhat random topic to the next. I've put forth the "I got mine" theory, and challenged the us vs. them mindset of modern debate. Today's topic touches on everything I've written about so far. We are going to take a look at the distribution of wealth in America, and how it has changed over the last twenty years. This article is not about Republicans and Democrats, left vs. right, or any other conventions we get bogged down in all the time. It is about looking at cold, hard facts to draw conclusions. We must establish what reality is before debating whether we need to change course. Not everyone regularly prepares and uses spreadsheets as I do, so I will try my best to make points without being too dry with numbers. All stats cited in this article are taken from the IRS website, so that saves a lot of bickering about reliability. While we all know that some people are creative about what they report as income to the IRS, for argument's sake we're going to assume it's a wash across income levels. Let's also keep in mind that those who make less than a certain threshold don't have to file, so they are left out of these stats completely. To put it another way, the unemployed are not included here, so no comments about deadbeats today. I'm also targeting percentage stats rather than dollar figures, so we don't have to worry about pesky variables like inflation. Full disclosure: Personally, I'm just barely within the top 25% of income earners, which includes anyone whose adjusted gross income was over $64,702 in 2006. Now, let's get fiscal.

Whenever the subject of taxes comes up, those at higher income levels complain that they shoulder a disproportionate tax burden. This statement is based on the idea that a higher percentage of their incomes are taken by the government than from those making less. In this sense, the numbers back up their claim. Of all federal income taxes collected in 2006, almost 40% of the revenue came from the top 1% of taxpayers. Over 135 million returns were filed that year, so that's roughly 1.35 million Americans paying two fifths of the taxes. This represents a dramatic increase over the last 20 years. Back in 1986, this same group was paying 25.75% of all income taxes. A look at the top 10% of taxpayers reveals a less dramatic increase but a huge overall burden. In 2006, the top 10% of taxpayers accounted for over 70% of taxes collected. Think about that for a moment. As a nation we are reliant on fewer than 14 million people for 70% of our federal income tax revenue. On the other end of the spectrum, the bottom 50% of those who filed returns paid only 3% of all taxes collected.

How is it possible to extract so much revenue from such a small portion of the population? Of all the individual income made in 2006, the top 1% of the people made 22% of the money. This proportion has doubled over the last twenty years. That bears repeating. Of all the personal income made in this country, the top 1% are taking in twice as high a percentage as they were twenty years ago. The wealthiest Americans are paying a tax rate which is over 30% lower than the rate they paid in 1986, and they are paying it on twice as high a share of income. Over the last twenty years, the top 10% of taxpayers have gone from making 35% of the income to 47%, while their tax rate has fallen by 20%. The bottom half have lost ground, going from making 16.66% of total income to just 12.5% in 2006.

These numbers tell us several things. The well off do pay a much higher portion of taxes than the middle or lower class. They also make a substantial share of total income, and have dramatically gained ground in that area over the last twenty years. But it's not just the super rich who are prospering, it's the merely well off too. In fact until you reach the bottom half of income earners, every group has seen an increase in their portion of national income. In other words, there has been a dramatic redistribution of wealth where not only have the rich gotten richer, those who merely make $100K+ are also holding a higher share of total income. The bottom half, on the other hand, have seen their share of total income fall by 25% over the last twenty years. This shift has been facilitated in large part by substantially lower tax rates on those making the most money.

So fiscal reality is quite clear. The standard of living in America has improved for the top half of the country, and lowered for the rest. In simplest terms, one set of people are enjoying better lives at the direct expense of the other. I will refrain, however, from going on a bleeding heart liberal rant here. That ground has been covered, and there's a more practical way to look at the situation. With pensions almost extinct, and benefits slowly but surely following, there is no reason to think this trend of wealth being concentrated toward the top will end without intervention. What will happen if no action is taken?

The theory most commonly known as trickle-down economics is fundamentally flawed. As mentioned, less than 14 million people currently account for 47% of the income and climbing. Who will be able to afford a home or a car at this rate? Major appliances, remodeling, tourism, restaurants, you name the business and it is reliant on a large customer base to prosper. If the masses aren't paid well enough to buy things, their employers will go out of business, and the theory of fair wages being a job killer will be disproved with catastrophic results. Capitalism spurs innovation, and helped us prosper in the 20th century. The problem today is that the ambition which helped us thrive has turned to rampant greed. Some say we need to start producing again rather than be a service economy. The danger is that we will end up like the very third world countries we have exploited in the past, making goods to be used by foreigners for wages that don't cover food and shelter. At its core, our system functioned because we merely used cash to facilitate trading the sweat of our brow for stuff we need. As long as the money kept circulating, the system worked. Now we have those on top cheating the workers by hoarding the cash. An increase of less than 5% in total unemployment is enough to put us in a deep recession. The same thing happens when people have a job but make less for doing it. It only seems harmless because people don't lose their homes right away, and easy credit facilitates the illusion that nothing has changed. Capitalism is a tremendous economic model, and I defy anybody to point to one that has yielded better results. But left unchecked, it threatens to consume us all.

It's clear we cannot go on as we are now. The working class, on whom we depend for our economy to work, are being squeezed out by those who are already on top. The growing concentration of wealth at the top has to end as soon as possible. We can do this in two ways. First, we need tax rates to be brought back in line with what they were during the Reagan Administration. Second, we need to have an honest social contract with those doing the most work for the least pay. If their wages cannot be brought up, their living expenses should be brought down. We must properly fund public transportation so they can get to work, and take the crippling cost of health care off their backs. We also have to make higher education accessible so bright minds which happen to be born into poverty are allowed to thrive and make our nation stronger. This is not communism or socialism, it's what must be done for the 21st century to be one of prosperity, and to stop the slide toward feudalism we are currently on.



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Comments (27)

 
"I'm just barely within the top 25% of income earners, which includes anyone whose adjusted gross income was over $64,702 in 2006. Now, let's get fiscal."

64,000 makes you in the top 25% earners? WOW, Shockmaster, that is a amazing stat.I am in that range and would never have thought of myself in the top fourth of wage earners.

Your article is well written........again. I still have a uncomfortable feeling about what your talking about as far as income re-distribution goes. I know this, I may be close to your tax bracket, but I am no were near a "rich" guy.

So who decides whats too much as far as compensation goes? Should hollywood actors make 20 million a flick? Should politicians make 20,000 a speech(or more). I think when we start talking about how much is too much, then we are on a slippery slope.


Posted By: John Galbraith (Guest)  on October 01, 2009 at 11:59 PM

 
 
sorry. the richest man on the planet, bill gates, has given over a billion to charity. His product has helped to streamline the medical industry, thus helping to save many more lives. He's changed the world, and if you think that he should relinquish any part of his earnings, then there is just something wrong with you. people who say 'enough is enough' are ridiculous. It's noone elses business to tell you that something you have is excessive. It's just obnoxious and an example of socialism at it's worst.

Posted By: Guest#1319 (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 12:14 AM

 
 
I would have preferred a bleeding heart liberal rant.

You provide data on the percentage of Federal taxes paid by top one, ten, twenty percent of tax payers by income. What percentage does the bottom sixty, thirty or twenty contribute to total taxes collected?

Why do you believe that everyone who is successful are, "on top cheating the workers by hoarding the cash." Gimme a break.

The dynamics of wealth distribution is not a zero sum game, therefore, changes in the distribution of annual income between quintiles does not begin to provide any evidence for a redistribution from poor to rich. Simply because one group of people incomes have grown faster than another does not mean, "The standard of living in America has improved for the top half of the country, and lowered for the rest." The standard of living has not decreased for any socio-economic group during this time period.

What if during this same period the amount of goods produced and the money supply both increased. So if you have more dollars, people who may earn those dollars did not do so at the expense of anyone. Dollars were created, but into banking system and loaned to people buying goods or investing in capital. As the saying goes, the problem with socialism is that you eventually run-out of OPM.

Oh, by the way, your welcome for the 70%. I didn't steal it, horde it, oppress anyone, take it at the expense of the poor, or come by it through jealousy. I went to work everyday and did the job I was employed to do and paid over forty-percent to Federal, State and local governments. Again, your welcome.


Posted By: AdmChesterMynutz (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 12:52 AM

 
 
why do i have a feeling this article will piss people off when it shouldnt? He said when wages dont go up then living expenses shouldnt go up.. Ohhh obviously he wants SOCIALISM..... year by year little by little middle class wages disproportionately went down and upper class wages disproportionately went up. dont tell me theres no correlation between that and todays problems

And 1319, this article isnt about the philanthropy of the top billionaire but rather the disproportionate wage increases and tax cuts for the billionaires and millionaires of this country. Thats not advocating socialism. Saying the rich have gotten too rich, too greedy? How is that advocating socialism?

Why does it seem anytime someone insinuates that the middle class and poor get screwed by the upper class they get called a socialist? Or there waging class warfare?

Here comes a "lets defend rich ppl cuz they create jobs" bullshit comment


Posted By: PETE (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 03:50 AM

 
 
Whether you agree or not with him, that was a very THOUGHTFUL column. Good job, Jason.

Posted By: The Great Capt. Smooth (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 05:31 AM

 
 
Forget this economics stuff when there is a much more grave crisis facing the world's most powerful nation:

THE BANNING OF FLAVORED CIGARETTES!

This far overshadows the continued problem of the rich fucking the poor.


Posted By: Q:? (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 08:24 AM

 
 
A good thing to remember is during the biggest economic boom the highest tax rate was in the 70s. During the Ike admin the highest tax rate was 90%, oddly enough that's when the most money was put into infastructure. Since 1967 money has been taken from the bottom 98% of this country and given to the top 2%, annnnd the top tax bracket has gone down from roughly 50% during Reagan to 33% now..well I gotta say as par of the 98% who's living standard has been hurt by what amounts to an oligarchy..fuck the top 2% I want my money BACK.

Posted By: Eric (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 09:06 AM

 
 
Your entire approach is flawed because you're basing it all on this assumption that wealth simply exists, in a static number and so the percentages are indicative of improvement or in other words that there is one pie and if one group has more than other groups have less. Wealth is created as a result of being productive (at least in capitalist or mixed economies it is) and the highest earners do not have more because they have stolen it from those below them but because they create or produce something that they have convinced others to give them money for. You also reference the top earners as if they are a static group, as if no one ever rise from the lowest earners to the highest or vice versa which is also completely false in our system because there is so very much movement. Remember that in the US the largest group of millionaires are FIRST generation wealthy, not the result of inheritance!

You say that you based this all on facts but I believe that tax data by its very nature as well as the way that you used it has been pretty much tortured to give these results. Stick to ethical arguments since if you can establish what is/is not ethical than you will find what works by its very nature. Instead relying on your data is misleading and leaves you with many straw man arguments.


Posted By: ChErikS (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 09:29 AM

 
 
Here comes a "lets defend rich ppl cuz they create jobs" bullshit comment

Posted By: PETE (Guest) on October 02, 2009 at 03:50 AM

Whether you agree with that statement, it is absolutely true.

When was the last time, a welfare recipient opened up a business and hired 10 people for 20 yrs at a living wage?


Posted By: Mikel (too lazy to log in) (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 09:55 AM

 
 
You want to know why the divide has grown so much? Because the lower half is fucking stupid with their money. They spend, spend, spend - McDonald's for the kids, crap at Wal-Mart every week, credit cards, rent or a mortgage that is more than they can afford. Overdraft charges and interest. They don't know how to save!

The reason the top half make more - in particular, the very top part of that half - is because many of them have been smarter with their money and not squandered it away on useless junk, but invested it - in stocks, real estate, businesses, or even just themselves in the way of education and discipline.


Posted By: Rob H (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 10:14 AM

 
 
The economy is not a zero-sum game. If I win that doesn't mean someone else loses. The only caveat to that I fear is Wall Strret traders when they naked short sell. This enables them to push down the price of a stock artifically without taking collateral in the stock,which can lead to massive sell runs on stocks. I believe they have banned this, however, but they also need to reinstate the uptick rule whereby nobody can sell a stock short unless the last price movement was upward. Otherwise, this can lead to large funds putting massive downward pressure on a stock price and lead to frantic selling, which hurts 401k's and average investors, most of whom are investing with an emphasis on the long view. Short selling is a vital part of the capital markets,but it does have the potential for unfairness unless those rules are implemented.

As for health care, enough already. The solution is obvious. Open up interstate competiton between insurance companies, roll back government mandates on what they must cover that is non-catastrophic, and introduce some tort reform. Medicare and Medicaid are going broke. Now is not the time to expand government influence. If we also remove the unfair tax break that corporate employees get at the expense of the self-employed, and let everyone buy insurance on their own we will see lower prices and far less pre-exisitng condition situations that occur when somebody gets sick in between jobs. THAT will help the economy, not more government intervention in the marketplace.


Posted By: Da Man (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 10:17 AM

 
 
John Galbraith:

That stat surprised me too. I'm doing unusually well for a 32 year old, but thought it was mostly my money management and not having a wife or kids. As for compensation, I alluded to my take on it. If those toward the bottom, a shockingly high percentage of us, are working and still can't make ends meet, we are in danger of the whole economy collapsing or worse, existing to serve other countries.

AdmChesterMynutz:

"On the other end of the spectrum, the bottom 50% of those who filed returns paid only 3% of all taxes collected."

I had a lot of figures in here, so you probably just missed that one. I also said the income share of the bottom HALF of the nation has fallen 25% in the last 20 years. They use credit to have the same or better lifestyle as in the past, but it's not real. Eventually the bills come due, and they either pay only the interest or declare bankruptcy, passing the cost on to the rest of us. Don't get me wrong, I fault THEM for living in denial and making their own messes, but so many do it that things seem fine. In fact our economy depends on them spending whether they really have the money or not. This is a broken system being exposed.

Adm, I don't doubt you work hard for your income, as do I. But so do a lot of other people, and they're working harder than ever for longer hours yet being paid less, a trend which shows no signs of slowing. So what happens when only the top quarter of us can afford to buy anything?

I took care not to make this article about fairness since that is such a subjective concept. I pointed to the simple truth that the further we go in our current direction, the harder it will be to sustain. There is no justification for those on top keeping an ever increasing share of income, and the fact that they do so proves that funneling money from the top down doesn't work. It's not about creating jobs, it's about creating GOOD jobs that pay enough for the system to work again.

Pete: You're spot on about the point of the article, thanks.

The Great Capt. Smooth: Thanks for the compliment.


Posted By: Jason Douglas (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 10:27 AM

 
 
"I still have a uncomfortable feeling about what your talking about as far as income re-distribution goes. I know this, I may be close to your tax bracket, but I am no were near a "rich" guy.
Posted By: John Galbraith (Guest) on October 01, 2009 at 11:59 PM"

Honestly, I think the fact that you are so far "up the chain" and it doesn't feel that way is very telling.

I realize the top percentile pays the highest percentage in tax but they also have access to the most and highest tax breaks. It's like complaining about our "high corporate tax rate" without factoring in the number of tax shelters available, particularly for the biggest corporations.

I've often wondered how the numbers would get crunched if everyone had to pay a flat tax, no deductions or exemptions, that was a percentage equal to the % of national income earned (i.e. the top 1% pays 22% in tax, no exemptions or deductions). I don't know what the results would look like, but I would be VERY curious about it.

To Pete: A number of people believe in a pure capitalistic society without factoring in the reality that we are not a pure capitalistic society. As such, there will be complaints about any manipulation of wealth, whether or not it actually goes along with what is best for the country or not.


Posted By: J. Alexander Mitchell (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 10:46 AM

 
 
"The dynamics of wealth distribution is not a zero sum game, therefore, changes in the distribution of annual income between quintiles does not begin to provide any evidence for a redistribution from poor to rich. Simply because one group of people incomes have grown faster than another does not mean, "The standard of living in America has improved for the top half of the country, and lowered for the rest." The standard of living has not decreased for any socio-economic group during this time period.

What if during this same period the amount of goods produced and the money supply both increased. So if you have more dollars, people who may earn those dollars did not do so at the expense of anyone. Dollars were created, but into banking system and loaned to people buying goods or investing in capital. As the saying goes, the problem with socialism is that you eventually run-out of OPM."


How do you factor in the thought that inflation levels are constantly rising into your equations? If costs are going up due to inflation and the percentage of income earned has gone down, the amount of total money generated would have to increase not only by enough to make that 16% twenty years ago equal to 12% now, but must also increase enough to factor in overall increases in costs, no?


"Oh, by the way, your welcome for the 70%. I didn't steal it, horde it, oppress anyone, take it at the expense of the poor, or come by it through jealousy. I went to work everyday and did the job I was employed to do and paid over forty-percent to Federal, State and local governments. Again, your welcome.

Posted By: AdmChesterMynutz (Guest) on October 02, 2009 at 12:52 AM"

I think there is a not-so-subtle class difference in reference to how the rich get rich. I think that most people so not view the rich as lazy good for nothings that are given everything unless you are talking about Paris Hilton. However, I would also say that ACCESS to wealth and the ability to cross class lines through hard work (or the ability to drop in class as a result of a lack of hard work) is NOT equal across class lines...


Posted By: J. Alexander Mitchell (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 11:01 AM

 
 
Yeah, I’m in the top 25% as well – but I live in a GHOST TOWN, where unless your name is Wal*Mart or McDonald’s you don’t stand a chance at creating new business revenue on your own. I want to say that is the fault of the residents themselves, as they are too set in their ways to attempt anything new and actually *gasp* support small, local businesses.

There is NO public transportation, NO taxis, NO delivery service of any kind. The roads are full of potholes and I see cones everywhere, but no one has done jack shit on them for almost a YEAR. All the money invested in this town went to a nice state-of-the-art performing arts center – which is nice, but…Um…how is anyone going to get there without ad revenue, basic transportation and ROADS?

Myself and my wife pay a LOT of taxes. We live in a town where a good portion of people work – and I’ll admit we’re better off than most, but it’s obvious that we can’t shoulder the load as much as those who are below us on the tax bracket. I’ve attended town council meetings and have discussed ideas to rejuvinate our town and get the community involved. What am I told by the mayor and council?

Invest. I ask, “Invest in what? There’s nothing here.”

They tell me to find ventures OUTSIDE the county limits and convince them to bring business here.

???

I say, “So…What about the people already here? Can’t I invest in them?”

“…We have the PAC. We have the strip where Wal*Mart is.” Wal*Mart is a good additional 12 minutes away from the actual heart of the town, because it sits on the edge of a desolate highway. I want to know what is being done about the actual town where the PEOPLE live. I’m told about how much tax revenue/credit/breaks were put in to build the PAC, and the highway to bring business to the town Wal*Mart. And it seems everyone is OKAY with that. *shakes head*

The problem isn’t the idea of wealth distrubution through taxes, it’s HOW it’s done. We have levees to how the town should spend the tax money it recieves but we have NO SAY RIGHT FROM THE START in how to spend it. The town decides that. They have their budget, examine losses and figure how to recoup. They look at short term gains. I have not once seen a plan that says, “Our town SUCKS, people are moving away and AVOIDING us and spending less money here. Let’s consider a long-term plan that encourages spending in our town including help for small business on main-street. Let’s consider spending patterns based on $$$ to Wal*Mart and try to obtain shops that fit the needs of this town rather than have a one-stop shop that KILLS everything in its path. When we have a levee, let’s put ALL options on the table for what the RESIDENTS feel they should spend their taxes, instead of telling them what our group of 8 people want.


Posted By: The 8th Samurai (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 12:03 PM

 
 
EVERYONE on the internet earns in the top 1%. This is a well known fact. Even Joe the plumber, who doesn't in fact earn that money, on TV he thinks he does. People on the internet also sleep with super model GFs, are super athletic, and are all top level fighters. A discussion on the internet will always this be skewed from reality.

The problem is generally that corps do not pay the proper amount of taxes, and a lot of them relocate outside of the country to avoid paying those taxes. Tighten that up, and suddenly there is far more tax money to be had.

Also, there is a difference in the value of your money depending on how much you make. After you have a certain amount, it doesn't really affect your food or the choice for your kid's college etc. But someone just barely scraping by on $30k a year is going to feel that tax burden more, especially if they've got student loans or what not, than somebody making $150k even adjusting for paying for more taxes. Employees also obviously generally pay more in taxes, because self employed or those in charge of businesses either report creatively, as you mentioned, but also what you didn't mention is they use their businesses to give themselves perks. Especially if you work from home, your standard of living will be higher than other people that pay more taxes than you because of the writeoffs.

70% of the economy is based on consumer spending, and most of that spending is sought from the middle class, not the very top. I'd also say that it's very easy to manipulate all these tax statistics to what you want to see, by ignoring as many factors as you want.

Personally, I think the government is too damn big and people just get taxed too much period. I'd rather switch to a consumption based tax model. Thanks to the current economic model, even including improvements, maybe this will actually happen now. A consumption model is really the most fair model.


Posted By: Guest#7193 (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 12:09 PM

 
 
J.Alexander,

I am far up the chain? Really? What's telling? Are you making judgements you know nothing about?

By the way, it looks like I am going to need every penny, seeing that electric rates are going to "neccesarily skyrocket" Even though you deny the comment was ever made.


Posted By: John Galbraith (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 01:36 PM

 
 
"I am far up the chain? Really? What's telling? Are you making judgements you know nothing about? "

Posted By: John Galbraith (Guest) on October 02, 2009 at 01:36 PM

"64,000 makes you in the top 25% earners? WOW, Shockmaster, that is a amazing stat.I am in that range and would never have thought of myself in the top fourth of wage earners."

Posted By: John Galbraith (Guest) on October 01, 2009 at 11:59 PM

Somehow, I don't think this really falls under "making judgements".

I find it humorous that you seem to latch on to the discussion about cap and trade. You know... the one where I open up by saying that it will increase our bills, at least short term. I'm not sure if you've noticed this, but it is not the case that I have no response. It is the case that I was IGNORING YOU. The fact that you are quick to antagonize when someone repeats your own statement reminds me why I decided it would be best to ignore you. Sorry about slipping up on that today; it won't happen anymore.


Posted By: J. Alexander Mitchell (Registered)  on October 02, 2009 at 03:10 PM

 
 
Again a good article which will be read by a few intelligent readers and a large number of simplistic idiots. Great job btw-- enjoyable read.

You summed it up best when you said if wages for the lower class don't go up then cost of living must go down.

I live in a "wealthy" town in Connecticut where most of those who were born and raised here can not afford to buy homes here and instead we get an influx of people from elsewhere slowly come in and change everything (New York & Boston people mostly)

A large portion of people on this site seem to be of the impression that the poor should simply be put down or left to die in the streets: take their benefits! give them mroe taxes! mwahaha if they were real "go getters" they'd go and make something of their lives. They don't seem to understand that, for a large number of Americans (and that's all races for you bigots who think only minorities are poor), for a lot of us if you don't take the cuffs off they'll never get a CHANCE to fly.


Posted By: M:-X (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 03:40 PM

 
 
ChErikS:

First, I understand the idea that if total income for the nation has spiked, the bottom half can live well even if their share is less. There are too many variables to delve into that accurately. I'll just point out that college tuition far outpaces inflation, as do medical expenses and some utilities, so income is just one factor in comparing people's standing today to the past.

As for top earners being static, that was covered in a previous article where I stated that anyone, but not everyone, can get ahead. Theoretically having a chance at earning a good living is not the same as actually getting to. That doesn't mean everyone should make $45K a year. But when good salaries become too scarce to attain, college won't be worth it, and our ability to compete globally will be compromised.

"Wealth is created as a result of being productive"

This statement is becoming less true every year. My comment to AdmChesterMynutz largely covers this. I personally benefit from having a marketable skill which only select people possess, AND a job in that field. Such status is getting harder to come by.

As for my use of stats, I decided blindly what info I wanted to research, then presented what was there, some of which surprised me. I find it alarming we are reliant on so few people for so much of our revenue. Of course, a more even income distribution would mean the tax burden could be shifted away from the top earners while bringing in the same revenue, but I doubt they'd go for that. As for ethical arguments, I didn't want ethics to be a distraction from this fact finding mission, but that may be my next article.

Mikel:

"Let's also keep in mind that those who make less than a certain threshold don't have to file, so they are left out of these stats completely. To put it another way, the unemployed are not included here, so no comments about deadbeats today."

I don't know how I could have been more clear.


Posted By: Jason Douglas (Registered)  on October 02, 2009 at 03:50 PM

 
 
Mr. X,

Nobody wants the poor to die. You should try and look at it this way. Yes, benefits for the poor are necessary and required of a compassionate society such as ours, but the problem becomes when there are too many taxes to pay for these benefits, that takes AWAY opportunities for the poor to get jobs whereby they can then earn themselves out of dependency. Because then the people who create those jobs are less incentivized to do so if they are going to be taxed inordinately. Which then leaves the poor in a cycle of dependency on benefits, which should not be the goal of our society. A static class unable to move out of their station because they are kept sustenant by government handouts. Lowering taxes CREATES opportunities for these people via the opportunities siezed by others. Nobody's asking them to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. But if the tax balance becomes out of whack, then they even lose the opportunity to earn themselves out of their situations and become ensnared in a cycle of dependency. Sure, they can survive like that, but why do we want them to exist that way?


Posted By: Da Man (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 04:27 PM

 
 
I make good money and I ain't gonna feel guilty about it one little bit. I earned it by working my ass off through school (both a BSc in astrophysics and a journeyman ticket in roofing) and slugging it out everyday at a job to get where I am.

What I didn't do was sit around and cry about how rich people were taking my entitlements and expecting my left wing overlords to march into their homes and take all their stuff away and give it to me.


Posted By: Mikel (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 04:44 PM

 
 
Excellent article!
I agree with the major tenets of your argument.
What people are missing here is how rich this 1% really is - this isn't necessarily your surgeon friend or even a lawyer, these people are making MAJOR money.
For instance, how many people do you know (or even know OF) who actually make that much money?
I am 29, a teacher, and apparently near the top 25% in income. I know NO ONE my age or even under 40 who is making much more than me, and even the doctors and lawyers and corporate cubicle workers aren't making NEAR 250K a year. The top 1% is DOMINATING our entire existence. They rule the politics, the large companies, the media, etc. This isn't a conspiracy theory as much as it is a statement to all the meritocracy fans out there who think the poor need to button their chin straps and work hard and make top 10% money. How, exactly? What college degree out there will let you graduate and move into a position to make that kind of money? Even with a M.B.A. you would have a hard time making top 10% money within 20 years of graduating. This is what these merit-based people seem to forget - the 1% is holding on to their supposed hard earned money and paying their workers LESS AND LESS for the same work. They are paying LESS AND LESS to the government to provide the infrastructure and means for many of the bottom earners to move up via education. Exactly what business will an MBA grad (who is also 100K in debt from school) start up in 2009 that can even hope to put him/her in that top 10%? The rich are getting richer, and the middle class pays the brunt of it.
And, for all you haters of the poor for their spending habits it was the top 10-15% that ruined it for most of us. In Dallas, many empty nesters and others sold their houses for pennies on the dollar to move away from the minorities into new trendy houses (Mcmansions and the like) they could only afford with the housing bubble. When it burst, they lost a house too big for their family and too expensive to have purchased anyhow. These same greedy, keeping-up-with-the-Jones' mentality people then bitch and moan that it was risky loans to minorities and the poor that caused it. !HORSE HOCKEY!
I bet you can't even drive up to these 1%ers houses - they are all probably gated in a perfect metaphor for this economy...


Posted By: thedick203 (Registered)  on October 02, 2009 at 05:15 PM

 
 
Mikel care to compare the Canadian tax code to the US tax code so we have some frame of reference for your statement? This article is about the US tax code..

Posted By: Guest#6857 (Guest)  on October 02, 2009 at 08:54 PM

 
 
One important fact that is left out is that when the tax rate is too high on earners (such as the 90% rate someone mentioned under Eisenhower), then there is little incentive to work hard to earn more. By lowering the tax rates on the middle to top earners, they keep a high enough percentage of their earnings that are willing to work longer hours and continue their education to improve their job situation. It is easy to blame the rich for everything, but there are just as many dishonest people in every tax bracket. I work in the computer industry and I am by no means rich, but I put myself through college and have continued to take classes to improve my skills which has led to better jobs and more money. If I looked up and realized that continueing to learn and improve myself would lead to my extra revenue being taxed at 90% (unlikely, but just using an extreme example), then why would I want to use my free time to study knowing there was no payoff?

Posted By: Chris (Guest)  on October 04, 2009 at 02:24 PM

 
 
Mikel care to compare the Canadian tax code to the US tax code so we have some frame of reference for your statement? This article is about the US tax code..

Posted By: Guest#6857 (Guest) on October 02, 2009 at 08:54 PM

Essentially, we pay 20% higher taxes than you do and the wealthy pay even more.


Posted By: Mikel (Guest)  on October 04, 2009 at 10:55 PM

 
 
There are a few things that are missing here:

1) HOW the rich took the money from the poor. It is through The Federal Reserve. And until the Fed is disbanded, it will continue, no matter WHAT you do with the tax code and "redistributing the wealth"

2) Responsible management of your finances, no matter what you have/earn is a huge part of financial success.

3) The unspoken assumption in your article is that government NEEDS all the money it is taxing for. It doesn't. Part of the answer to this problem lies in shrinking government, how much it spends, and what it spends on.

4) The last 20 years, we have lived in the most socialistic times in our country - whether it was Clinton starting our country down the path of fiscal disaster by mandating mortgages to those who could not afford them, Bush and his "compassionate conservatism", which was a mask for the expansion of government, or Obama now - part of the problem IS the redistribution of wealth through the taxation code, which has been happening on a smaller scale for this 20 year period.

Kind of strange, isn't it? A country that continues to escalate it's welfare programs through 20 years of government, is actually making it tougher on its poorest citizens - instead of making it easier.

Perhaps "redistribution of the wealth" through the tax code isn't the answer after all...


Posted By: Stephen (Guest)  on October 07, 2009 at 02:01 AM

 
STAY CURRENT

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