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 411mania » Wrestling » Columns
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Shining a Spotlight 7.02.09: Icons
Posted by Michael Weyer on 07.02.2009





Like most everyone else, the death of Michael Jackson was a major shock to me. I grew up in this guy's prime, his music huge with everyone of my generation. It's hard to convey to people today how huge a star this man truly was. We've been so used to treating Jackson as a figure of ridicule and derision that's it's quite easy to forget that from 1984 to 1989, no one on this planet was a bigger star than he was. The biggest selling album of all time, sold out tours of wild fans, he even had his own Disneyland attraction. Yes, he'd fallen on harder times with the legal allegations and troubles, the behavior with his own kids, the freakish changes in his appearance and more. But the fact is, the man did blaze a trail with his music and left behind a status that secures him forever as a pop icon.

That has gotten me thinking a bit. There's always a tendency when someone so huge dies to look back at the positive things in his life, not the negative. That's happened here as some in the media have been able to take the high road and examine his career and impact rather than the salacious parts of his life. The term "icon" has been tossed about a lot and does fit Jackson. That has brought up to me that age old question among wrestling fans which is what stars of wrestling can be considered icons?
 

 
 
What makes an Icon

I should get it straight now that icons are not saints. Oh, some were decent guys like Jackie Robinson who should always be remembered as being not just the first black major league baseball player but a great one as well. On the other hand, Babe Ruth is certainly an icon, as even non-baseball fans know exactly who he is. But Ruth was also a womanizing, hard-drinking, gambling lout who held himself above all others. It's that way in a lot of fields of sports and entertainment, men and women who left behind amazing legacies but their personalities left quite a bit wanting as well.

Wrestling is filled with such people. I wrote a few weeks ago on how we rarely see the true person behind the persona since wrestlers mix it up so much. A recurring theme I've heard from wrestling radio show guys is how the workers they admire turn out to be jerks when on the show while the ones with bad reputations are polite guests. Wrestlers use their public images so much for working fans that it's hard to tell what's real and what's not. But you can still put some things aside to see the legacy men leave. It can be tricky to figure out. I remember in 1997 Jim Cornette did a terrific commentary on a RAW episode, trashing a lot of big guys over the entire "icon" mentality but the fact is, some guys do seem to belong on that level.

For icons in wrestling, you have to see men who established themselves as being almost bigger than the business itself. Men whose fame is so great everyone knows it and in most cases respects it as well. It can be tricky as the IWC has so many fanbases that are ready to champion personal guys as being bigger than they are. Jeff Hardy, CM Punk, Samoa Joe, all great wrestlers but icons? Not really. John Cena is a major guy for WWE, deserving of more respect than he gets but a long time before he can hit icon status. HHH seems to want to make himself an icon to be sure but I don't think he's there and not sure he'd get it because of the politics and bad blood many feel toward him. But there are some wrestlers who have managed to achieve that level, some to a bigger degree than others.

I will say I'm sticking to major wrestlers here. I know Terry Funk and Mick Foley are considered hardcore icons but that celebrates that style a bit more than it deserves. I enjoy Mick a lot and his fame has grown with his books but it's a bit much calling him an icon as Mick himself would admit he was no technical master in the ring. Funk deserves respect for his longevity but a bit annoying he's regarded more for brutalizing himself in the ring. In terms of fame on various fronts, the following men have cause to lay claim to the icon label.

 
 
 
The First Ones
 
The icon mentality didn't form with the modern era of course. Lou Thesz is a name still well known and respected by wrestlers today. The man helped shape modern wrestling with his technical styles and shooting and mentioning his name today conjures images of old-style wrestling at its finest. Gorgeous George was the first to be more a character than a wrestler with his outrageous style that set a new tone for televised wrestling and personas. Buddy Rogers was the first truly awesome heel, able to work it with a wild style not only in the ring with his strutting but also on the mic, the first guy to work a crowd both ways like that. Bruno Sammartino may have been a bit flat by today's standards but helped put WWF on the map as champion while Pedro Morales broke out as a major ethnic star. Superstar Billy Graham can also be considered an icon as he was a man truly ahead of his time with his muscular build, wild outfits and amazing promo work that would be emulated by scores of wrestlers afterward.

These guys really paved the way for others who followed and made strides in the business that rose above the territory boundaries of the time. That's something to recall, that a lot of guys could be considered iconic but to their local markets. Jerry Lawler in Memphis, the Von Erichs in Texas and more. But the fact was, they were local stars most of the time and really not known on a national level. Those that follow, the men who really can be considered icons, are the ones whose fame is on equal level with their impact on the business.
 
 

 
Flair and Hogan
 
As far as icons go, harder to top these two. They were wrestling in the ‘80's and ‘90's, two men who were just on such a higher plateau than others and that remains today. Flair in his prime was a master working the crowds with his promos and great style in the ring, keeping Jim Crockett Promotions going as NWA champion. Hogan, of course, made WWF world famous and while he was no great shakes in the ring, his sheer charisma with the crowds made him and his bouts seem bigger than they already were.

Both men had flaws with their egos. Hogan's is famous while Flair has also rubbed some folks the wrong way with some of his moves, which can be seen as self-serving at times. I have read interesting pieces on how some guys give Hogan a lot of credit for making them look good in the ring, that you came off a bigger star just facing him. Flair had that talent too as both of them helped wrestling achieve its peak in popularity in the ‘80's. But the fact is that when it comes to being the bigger icon for fans, I think Hogan has the edge. Even today, you put on "Real American" at an arena and it'll erupt as fans will still go crazy for him. Flair himself has been forced to acknowledge on DVD that while most non-wrestling fans won't know who he is, they will know Hogan. Mention wrestling to the mainstream and Hogan is the first to pop into mind and that's a legacy that deserves respect no matter what else the man has done.



 

Bret and Shawn

Neither of them will want to admit it but Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels have always been a lot alike. Both rising in the ranks on their achievements, both amazing in the ring and both possessing two incredibly complex egos. To Canadians, Bret is a massive hero although that source of pride did contribute to his most infamous moment. Shawn's fame has been boosted by his own ego a bit although fans always respond. In the '90's, both men were able to keep WWF going with their terrific matches and great abilities and earned the respect of fans the world over.

Both legacies have been hurt a bit, Shawn by his personal problems and being out of the business for a while. But Shawn has gotten some respect for turning in terrific matches a decade after everyone thought he was done and being up front over what an asshole he was in the '90's. Bret, however, has hurt his own standing with fans with his bitterness over things. Even some Canadian fans have been turned off by stuff like turning a tribute dinner to his father into a public tirade against an author for not ranking him higher in a book. Both men did help keep WWF hot at a time when things were bad and cemented themselves as true legends in the process. Their status as icons may not be as great as Flair and Hogan but hard to argue with their status at the time.



 
Stone Cold and the Rock

I admit calling the Rock an icon may be a bit much. Yes, he was huge with stardom and multiple title reigns but he didn‘t have quite the same massive status as some of the others on this list with fans. His matches were good and all but not quite a technical master or a good seller. There's the possibility he might have been able to really cement a true legacy if he hadn't left for Hollywood. So mega star, yes but icon? Not so much.

Austin on the other hand…This was a man everyone knew was going to be a star from his first match. He did do well in WCW but when he coined "Austin 3:16," he achieved a new level of fame. He had his difficulties from marriage troubles to walking out on WWF in 2002. But Steve Austin nevertheless shot wrestling to a level unheard of before. He had crowds going and rewrote what a face could be, acting the heel but still loved by the crowds. His feud with Vince began a new wave of "evil owner" characters in wrestling and his in-your-face style has been replicated time and again but never to the same success. He enjoyed great respect for his work and helping the entire company reach new heights. Stone Cold never gave much of a damn what other people thought of him and never considered himself an icon. Which may just help cement his status as one even more.

 


Sting

TNA has a rep for overblowing things but calling Sting an icon isn't one of them. Through all the ups and downs of WCW in the '90's, Sting was always there, something even Flair can't say. The man was incredibly hot in the early part of the decade, getting crowds fired up by his sheer presence and charisma, his own energy infectious and helped make him a star worth basing the company around. His transformation into "the Crow" look silent warrior actually made him hotter and while the end result wasn't good, his showdown with Hogan at Starrcade '97 was a huge affair thanks to that heat. That he never worked for WWF may have kept him from the great DVD set he deserves but his TNA work has still been good, reminding fans of his huge star status. Even better is how Sting has been hailed for his professionalism outside the ring, not getting in ego troubles or anything like that, a down to earth guy in so many ways which has earned him the respect of most everyone he's ever worked with. It's rare to find a guy as nice outside the ring as in it and Steve Borden has been recognized for that. He may not be as great as he once was but this man was second only to Flair (and in some cases even bigger) in being the soul of the good side of WCW and that's a status that can't be taken away.



 
The Undertaker

It takes a special performer to maintain main event status for almost twenty years. The Undertaker has always managed to keep going thanks to his amazing gimmick that somehow has managed to win fans over. Undertaker has managed to shift the gimmick now and then to keep himself fresh but still keeps to the supernatural trappings that make him stand out. He also surprises by still being able to pull off some amazing matches despite his age and injuries, such as against Michaels at Mania. That he's never gone to another company has also won him admiration, the man is automatically associated with WWE and he also gets respect for being a top dog in the locker room and able to keep order among the egos there. That he gets the win so much is just a show of respect for his standing with fans, not the politics of others and the response of fans proves how over he still is. His Mania streak just adds a new layer to things and solidifies him as a true original in a business filled with copycats.


Summation

Choosing an icon in wrestling can be a tricky thing as this is a business that rests on guys making themselves look different than they really are. Too many times, fans will bring their personal views of men in and alter the picture of how they do and don't deserve the standing they have. Some guys on this list do deserve the icon name not just for ring achievements but for how their fame goes to a higher plateau than most other wrestlers. In some cases, you can argue about how that might be overblown (Bret, Rock and maybe Shawn) but in most, it can be agreed that while not saints, Hogan, Flair, Austin and Undertaker are men who helped the entire business around them and redefined what it meant to be a fan. Their names will live on for a long time to come and in leaving a true legacy behind, they truly deserve the icon name.



Also around 411mania:

Chin talks the Importance of Smackdown

The Bard converses with the greatest Star Wars video game character ever

For the Record examines Jack Swagger

The Shimmy continues the Cena report card

Five-Star catches up on comments

If I Could Be Serious talks booking

Don't forget Column of Honor, Triple Threat, 4 R's, Fact or Fiction and the rest.

For this week, the spotlight is off.





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Comments (28)

 
Good job. Given your criteria, the only other major wrestler that might be considered an icon is Roddy Piper, who has at least some mainstream recognition, as well as being the epitome of a great heel when wrestling exploded onto the mainstream.

Posted By: Michael L (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 12:14 AM

 
 
While not one yet, I would put Angle in the same category as HHH.

I dont know how exactly to fit Andre in on the list, but he has to figure somewhere.


Posted By: kid (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 12:19 PM

 
 
I'd include Savage too. He got the crossover media exposure and was huge as both a face and heel.

Posted By: Guest#5098 (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 12:19 PM

 
 
Very well written. Before I clicked on your article, Hogan and Sting came to mind. I would almost put Hogan in a category of his own. You mention WWE/F or WCW to a mainstream audience, and Hogan is most likely the name you would hear.

Posted By: Randy (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 12:29 PM

 
 
List needs some Andre. Every iconic hero needs an iconic villain, and Andre was Hogan's most famous nemesis.

Also, the Rock is a clear cut icon. He was one of the main reasons wrestling was so popular in the Attitude era, and most non-wrestling fans recognized the man even before he moved into acting.

Greatest mic worker ever, imo, and I can guarantee you any wrestling arena will erupt wif his theme music ever gets played again.


Posted By: Vordeo (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 12:36 PM

 
 
PIPER!!!!!!!

Posted By: FUZEY (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 12:48 PM

 
 
there are only four active ICONS in wrestling. undertaker, shawn michaels, sting, and kurt angle.

Posted By: rey (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 12:54 PM

 
 
Why arent I there?

I'll have to get my Dad to hire all these guys back so I can beat them and then you can all call me icon.


Posted By: Triple H (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 01:21 PM

 
 
An Icon is someone who represents their industry. It should be someone who the common man thinks of when the topic comes up. For example, Michael Jordan is a basketball icon. Isaiah Thomas is a great player, but not an icon. The only true icons in wrestling are: Hogan, Flair, Andre, Austin, Vince, and the Rock. The rest, while huge stars within the industry, are for the most part, nobodies outside of it. Piper probably comes next, but is not on the level that these others are.

Posted By: Guest#5124 (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 01:46 PM

 
 
Big props for not including that douche HHH on your list.

Posted By: Guest#9867 (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 01:56 PM

 
 
the rock is definitely an icon. every superstar today wishes they were him. hulk crossed over, so did piper and foley. yet none of them have been accepted as a serious actor like dwayne johnson.

i have to agree on kurt angle. he will go down as one of the top 5 ever to step in the ring


Posted By: jd (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 02:00 PM

 
 
Um, hellooooo????

Posted By: Paul Roma (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 02:20 PM

 
 
so, no andre the giant on this list. hmmm, the man was only known worldwide, and referred to as the 8th wonder of the world. he was beloved by all, but not an icon? and i hate to say it, but the little mention of bruno sammartino just didn't cut it for me. the guy held the wwwf title for seven years, eight months, and one day. 'nuff said.

Posted By: hartfan (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 03:21 PM

 
 
the four guys who have made the biggest names for themselves that even non-wrestling fans know, is Hogan, Stone Cold, The Rock, and John Cena.

Posted By: supa sta (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 03:27 PM

 
 
Like him or not..HHH will likely be looked upon as an icon.
Even though he's been a face for the past, what? 3 years.. he was clearly one of the biggest heels of the past 10 years...He is INCREDABLY over with the audience and does any one remember his return after his first quad surgery.. his pop was beond HUGE


Posted By: Nicole (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 04:19 PM

 
 
"For icons in wrestling, you have to see men who established themselves as being almost bigger than the business itself. Men whose fame is so great everyone knows it and in most cases respects it as well."

If that's your definition, how can Bret Hart be considered an icon? Maybe he is in Canada, but he was never "almost bigger than the business" in the U.S.


Posted By: Bob (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 04:42 PM

 
 
1) I agree that Andre should have been mentioned at least. I'm not sure if he is an "Icon", but he is a legend in the business.

2)Kurt Angle could have come close, but his injuries and drug problems really slowed his momentum and going to TNA officially stopped it. Like it or not, without any mainstream (or close to it) exposure it is hard to even get close to Icon status, and TNA is only known to wrestling fans while WWE has cemented its place in pop culture.

3)Cena is probably the closest to becoming an Icon that is not considered one already. Like it or not as well, he is the biggest star in the WWE right now (Vince just doesn't realize it. Shows how disconnected he is with his audience...) even though he isn't being booked like it right now.

4)I'm not sure if I agree with Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, and Undertaker. While they have their place in wrestling history they just weren't the mega superstars that the others mentioned were. If they are accepted as Icons then you certainly have to include the Rock.

When non-wrestling fans talk about how they used to talk watch wrestling, Attitude Era, they always mention the Rock. I think he was a bigger Pop Culture Icon as a wrestler than as an actor.


Posted By: dkfx (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 04:56 PM

 
 
"the four guys who have made the biggest names for themselves that even non-wrestling fans know, is Hogan, Stone Cold, The Rock, and John Cena."

I agree with you as far as Hulk Hogan, but to not the rock. Hes dwayne Johnson now, and are you serious about Cena? I think not!!!


Posted By: rick goodwin (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 05:35 PM

 
 
How do you have an icon list without Randy Savage, and where you claim The Rock isn't one?

If being an icon is mainstream knowledge, guys like Randy Savage, The Rock and of course Hulk Hogan clearly stand above everyone else (reverse order). I would add Bret Hart to the list, he's had appearances on The Simpsons and is in the opening for "Malcolm in the Middle" which was a reasonably popular sitcom. If you ask a non-wrestling fan who Shawn Michaels and Flair are, they probably wouldn't be able to tell you.

Undertaker and Brock Lesnar are two other names I probably should include as well though. Like The Rock, Lesnar had a career after wrestling that gave him even more exposure and mainstream awareness.

I don't like HHH and Cena much myself, but they're definitely identifiable more so than most of the other active wrestlers right now.

This list seems way more like a list of wrestlers you like than anything else. The Rock was at least better at selling and more technical than Hulk Hogan was. Yet it's a criticism you only have for The Rock and not for the other wrestlers on your list. In my opinion The Rock's in ring work was very good. It's obvious you just have a bias against some of these guys. Like I said, I don't like Cena or HHH, but I'm not suddenly going to just pretend they're not important guys.


Posted By: Guest#6523 (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 06:50 PM

 
 
Thank you to all the posters who mentioned Andre. This list is certainly not complete without him. Before Hulk Hogan and Ric Flair, there was Andre The Giant. He is credited with being the first internationally recognized wrestler. He was known and loved all over the world.

He was also in the Guinness Book of Records as the highest paid wrestler in history in 1974. Go anywhere in the world and people know who Andre The Giant was! Even the most casual of wrestling fans, who has never heard of The Rock or SCSA know who Andre was.

Don't forget, he was the other half of the most iconic moment in wrestling history!

If you need further evidence of his impact, look at this: the WWF/E Hall of Fame was created for Andre.

The Eighth Wonder of the World certainly deserves a mention on your list of icons!


Posted By: AndreFan (Registered)  on July 02, 2009 at 06:52 PM

 
 
Everyone knows who Sting is. You just gotta say "That one dude who looks like The Crow". Works everytime.

Posted By: Burnout (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 09:58 PM

 
 
Great column! I have to agree with many people here and say Andre should be on. As far as Cena goes, he isn't there yet and I'm not sure that the smarks would ever let him become one.

Posted By: The Great Capt. Smooth (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 10:03 PM

 
 
What about Raven?

Posted By: Guest#1980 (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 11:06 PM

 
 
An Icon is someone who represents their industry. It should be someone who the common man thinks of when the topic comes up. For example, Michael Jordan is a basketball icon. Isaiah Thomas is a great player, but not an icon. The only true icons in wrestling are: Hogan, Flair, Andre, Austin, Vince, and the Rock. The rest, while huge stars within the industry, are for the most part, nobodies outside of it. Piper probably comes next, but is not on the level that these others are.

Posted By: Guest#5124 (Guest) on July 02, 2009 at 01:46 PM

This is the truth here. The term "icon" is a massive thing and is not to be used lightly. There is no chance in hell you can label the likes of Bret Hart, HBK, Undertaker, Savage et cetera "icons" - legends yes, but not icons.

Icons are one in a billion, men who define an era, and are imprinted forever in the consciousness of the common man. Hogan is the true icon, the guy IS pro-wrestling as far as mainstream society is concerned. The only other icons are Andre, Flair, Austin, Rock and, as the poster above cleverly pointed out, Vince McMahon himself. To call HHH and others like him "icons" is absolutely ridiculous. The WWE would love nothing more than for people to think that about HHH, but it is not true and it never will be. Cena could become one in the future, because he has a massive fanbase of young fans who will grow up idolising him and so they will never forget their childhood hero John Cena no matter how old and cynical they become - but that's a long way ahead and anything could happen in between.


Posted By: Guest#9664 (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 11:41 PM

 
 
Savage isn't imprinted on people's minds? Savage has a VERY unique way of speaking, and some very unique lines. If you do the Macho Man voice and say "Ooooooh yeah" and "Can you DIG it?" or "Snap into a slim jim!" everybody recognizes that. That sounds like it fulfills the definition of icon.

Unless by icon people want to keep adding definitions. Like maybe "watched your wrestling matches" in which case yes, I'm sure really only Hogan has ever been an icon because he brought so many people into wrestling and they just watched his matches (and not his terrible movies).

But in terms of being mainstream, that has nothing to do with actually watching the matches or being fans of wrestling. Everybody knows who Mike Tyson is, but maybe a 10th of the people that bring his name up have actually watched his matches. That's an icon right there, the sheer number of people talking about you, even though they don't give a damn about your sport/show/etc. Hogan had that, and The Rock had that too. Savage might have had that, if only from Slim Jims commercials.


Posted By: Guest#5342 (Guest)  on July 02, 2009 at 11:55 PM

 
 
Umm...You forgot ROB VAN DAM!!!

Posted By: RVD 4:20 (Guest)  on July 03, 2009 at 01:30 AM

 
 
Me and some friends were discussing this last week...when being an icon of a particular gnre or industry are is one thing and being a pop culture icon is another. Like in hip hop Ice Cube is the real father of hardcore rap as a commerically viable form but as for music he isn't hat. Or lik ein rock Stevie Ray Vaughn is highly regarded but if you ask the average hip hop fan they would give you the gas face. So as for being icons beyond the wrestling world at this point it is SAVAGE HOGAN FLAIR ROCK and AUSTIN. I think you can throw Andre The Giant in thee as well. As for Icons of wrestling it is a bit longer and has to be taken by era...STING, HBK, UNDERTAKER(he and Shawn may be beign underrated by me),HHH, NwO, DX, LUGER kinda re the holy grail of the 90's (I am leaving soooo many guys out) But a cool article would be to break the icons of different eras down...hope to read it.

Posted By: THE GET SOME KID (Guest)  on July 03, 2009 at 04:18 PM

 
 
Yeah this is a great column...interesting.Usually 411 sucks and has wrestle nerd writers.

Only thing I disagree with is Superstar getting only honorable mentions.

The guy is up there with Bruno on the East Coast,man.He was Hogan before Hogan.

The only people to inspire more clones is probably Flair...who's a clone of Buddy Rogers.


Posted By: MacDollarz. (Guest)  on July 07, 2009 at 03:40 AM

 




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