The Wrestling Bard 12.26.09: Wrestlers of the Decade - #20-11
Posted by Aaron Hubbard on 12.26.2009
From kings to punks, from legends and legend killers, from Britain to Japan, who is knocking on the top ten?
All right, so a few things first. I don't really have the desire to say a lot nor do I have much space left to say it in, but I wanted to touch on a few things before I got to the list.
1) I am pleasantly surprised to see the number of Mistico fans. While I have seen Mistico wrestle, and respect anyone of his drawing power, I really have little interest in his opponents because I hate lucha-libre. Mistico has impressed me in spite of that. However, I will admit that part of the reason Mistico is so low is that there are eight Japanese wrestlers on this list, and there is enough racism going around without people saying "that worthless spick doesn't belong on the list".
2) On that note, those of you who complain about Japanese Wrestlers and ROH wrestlers on the list can shove it. This is NOT 411 WWE and TNA. This is 411 Wrestling. WWE has provided an excellent social networking site for the WWE Universe, which is better suited to your tastes. I'm sure they will provide a list of the greatest stars of the decade at some point. Enjoy reading about the fantastic careers of Chavo Guerrero and MVP (no offense to either gentleman).
3) And finally, to the guy who so eloquently said that technical wrestling is "faggots rolling around in their underwear", I have a challenge for you. Go to a WWE show, and tell that to Shawn Michaels, Triple H, Chris Jericho, Shelton Benjamin, and others who worked their asses off learning the sweet science. Or tune into RAW when Bret Hart, one of the greatest technical wrestlers of all time, gets a bigger pop than anyone else on the roster. Or perhaps you prefer TNA. I'm sure Angle will love to educate you on what WRESTLING is. And since you seem to ride the jockstraps of "stars" like Hulk Hogan, Steve Austin, and The Rock, I dare you to tell Hogan that technical wrestling means nothing, seeing as how he made more money than you've ever dreamed of "rolling around like a faggot" in Japan. I dare you to tell Austin, who prides himself for being able to hang with Bret Hart and Chris Benoit, that technical wrestling is "for faggots". And I dare you to tell The Rock, whose father put food on his table by "rolling around like a faggot", that wrestling means nothing.
I'm not saying it is right that fans hate John Cena because he doesn't throw German Suplexes and I have no problem with GOOD entertainment being in wrestling. But if you are watching wrestling and don't want to see WRESTLING, maybe you should find a new hobby. Go and watch Doom while the rest of us enjoy the name on the marquee, wrestling.
#20: Booker T/King Booker
Active Years: 2000-2009 Achievements: World Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), WCW World Champion (5 Times), WCW U.S. Champion (1 Time), WWE United Intercontinental Champion (1 Time), WWE U.S. Champion (3 Times), WWF Hardcore Champion (2 Times), TNA Legends Champion (1 Time, First), World Tag Team Champion (3 Times w/Test, Rob Van Dam & Goldust), TNA World Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Scott Steiner), King of the Ring 2006 Promotions Worked For: WWE, WCW, TNA Why He's #20: By sheer mass of titles won, Booker T was virtually guaranteed a spot on this list. Six World Title Reigns across the two biggest companies in North American History is a feat no other man has accomplished in the timeframe, not withstanding his numerous other titles. Booker was also the last World Champion in WCW, and while that was mostly done to get the title off of Scott Steiner because Steiner and the WWE were having negotiation problems (WWE didn't want him, Scott didn't want to go, or some combination thereof), it's still a nice feather in the cap of one of the most decorated wrestlers, in terms of titles, to grace a wrestling ring. However, Booker has other accomplishments that have placed him above some of the bigger names that arguably deserve this spot.
I don't think anyone can argue that Vince McMahon has a refusal to put over anything that was associated with WCW after the buy-out. You can see evidence in Triple H's second World Title run (the time he held it for most of 2003), how the WWF dominated the Alliance during the awful Invasion storyline, and even going back to 2000 when he decided to have Angle, not quite ready for big time but about to prove his worth, be King of the Ring over Chris Jericho, who was both better in the ring at that point and better on the mic. And you can see it with Booker T. When he came into WWE, he was the leader of the Alliance for all of a month before the WWE put Stone Cold Steve Austin in that position. After losing the WCW Title to The Rock, Booker was relegated to a makeshift tag team with Test. TEST. And in 2002, he traded Test out for Goldust. Despite being treated as midcard joke, Booker and Goldust had so much natural charisma and humor that many considered them the only reason to watch RAW during their existence. In 2003, when he was put in a racist angle with Triple H for Wrestlemania and was slated to lose, Booker put on one of the performances of his life and made a valid argument that he deserved to be World Champion.
The rest of Booker's 2003 was plagued by injuries, so we'll give WWE a pass there. In 2004, Booker was moved over to an ailing Smackdown! that had just lost Brock Lesnar to the NFL, Benoit to RAW, the World's Greatest Tag Team due to a split, and Big Show and Kurt Angle due to injuries. He was turned heel and seemed like a natural fit to face Eddie Guerrero. Instead, JBL was pushed into that position and Booker was put in a long feud with John Cena. 2005? Well, he had a feud with Kurt Angle because Angle wanted to have "bestiality sex" with Sharmell. And he had a feud with Heidenreich. WWE finally seemed to have the right idea by putting him in the ring with Benoit to try and recreate the magic of the Best of Seven series, and with more time to work and more experience, their matches were actually better than the ones in WCW. But then it was right back to stupidity in a feud with The Boogeyman, which gave us "The Hall of Freaks" and not much else.
It took a gimmick change brought on by King of the Ring to finally give Booker T his due. As King Booker, Booker T finally, FINALLY won a World Title in WWE by beating Rey Mysterio. Booker adapted to his new role as well as anyone could hope and had an extended feud with Batista before dropping it to him. But it was okay. King Booker looked to have finally carved his spot as a main event player in WWE, proving that hard work, charisma, and adaptability will win out over any unfair bias. Booker T was a success in spite of WWE's mistreatment, and that it is an accomplishment worth more than any of his numerous titles. Booker T would be released by WWE in 2007 following a debate over the Wellness Policy, and have moderate success in TNA before leaving this year. Whether Booker T's time has passed or if he will return to WWE, he has earned his place as one of the most underrated workers in the business. Why He Isn't Any Higher: If you couldn't tell by reading above, Booker spent most of the decade as a midcard guy. While he was over for his entire run and did the best he could, and eventually broke the glass ceiling, most WWE fans have already forgotten about him. While he is talented and charismatic, and uses a unique style mostly based on strikes that sets him apart from most other wrestlers, Booker is not a vital part of the wrestling scene. When you are treated like garbage, it's hard to come out smelling like roses.
#19: Nigel McGuinness/
Desmond Wolfe
Active Years: 2000-2009 Achievements: ROH World Champion (1 Time), ROH Pure Champion (1 Time), 1PW Openweight Champion (1 Time), HWA Heavyweight Champion (2 Times), HWA European Champion (2 Times), New Breed Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), HWA Tag Team Champion (2 Times w/The Human Time Bomb) Promotions Worked For: ROH, TNA, NOAH, HWA, 1PW, OVW, Various American and European Independent Promotions Why He's #19: I'm sure some of you are thinking, "Why is a guy who's only been in TNA for two months anywhere on this list?" And then there are some of who are undoubtedly thinking "Nigel should be higher." To the TNA fans, I politely tell you that most of TNA's excellent young talents that you beg TNA to push got their starts in Ring of Honor, a company that respects hard work above all else and gives wrestlers more than four minutes to wrestle more than once a month. And to the Ring of Honor fans; sorry, but until the masses learn to respect talent for talent's sake, (and until ROH gets its act together again), ROH will always be #3. As you can probably guess by looking at this list, another, more worthy wrestler represents ROH and the Indy Boom in the top ten.
Now, back to Nigel McGuinness and why he is this high. First of all, Nigel is one of the greatest technical wrestlers alive, with a European influence that makes him stand out from the crowd. Second, after CM Punk left ROH, the company was in desperate need of a strong talker with a well-defined character, and Nigel was one of the first to do that. Yes, he was playing the typical cocky British guy, but instead of pretending to be royalty, he used his own past as a soccer hooligan as his inspiration. When he won ROH's Pure Wrestling Championship, he was given the opportunity to really prove himself, and he did prove himself. His attitude drew the ire of most of the ROH audience, but he was so good in the ring that nobody could really say anything. Yes, he used an iron and would use the unique rules of the division to his advantage, but it was obvious he didn't need to. Nigel defined the Pure Championship, and did such a good of it that he was the longest reigning one and the last one to defend it, losing it in a unification match with Bryan Danielson at the appropriately named Unified show. It would be this match that would set Nigel on his way to the ROH World Title.
In 2007, Nigel became the biggest babyface in the company. Replacing his mat-based style with high-impact, hard hitting offense highlighted by multiple lariats, and used those lariats to defeat Takeshi Morishima for the title. What followed was an incredible 545 day run. After the ever-fickle ROH fans turned on Nigel, Nigel turned heel and went into overdrive. Combining the high-impact offense with his technical wrestling and outstanding heel mannerisms, Nigel was one of the best wrestlers in the world and a perfect Ring of Honor World Champion. Defeating former world champions like Danielson and Austin Aries, perennial challengers like Roderick Strong and KENTA, to young break-out stars like Kevin Steen and Tyler Black, Nigel seemed truly unstoppable. His reign was ended in March of this year by Jerry Lynn, and he helped put over Tyler Black before announcing he was leaving for WWE. In a huge swerve, he opted to go to TNA, where under the name of Desmond Wolfe, he has been on clinics with Kurt Angle for the last too months. Desmond will most likely be a top contender for the TNA World Title in 2010 and for the foreseeable future, and we can only assume he will continue to prove what ROH fans already know about him: he is a champion in every sense of the word. Why He Isn't Any Higher: Nigel McGuinness is fighting the obscurity of Ring of Honor. Talented though he is, the truth is most fans only know him as Desmond Wolfe. Wolfe has been a smash hit in TNA so far, delivering great matches and being instantly credible near the top of the card (proof that Ring of Honor fans DO know what they are talking about), most of his career means nothing to the typical fan. Shame really, but at least there's the silver lining that he has already caught the attention of most of the TNA fan base.
#18: Eddie Guerrero
Active Years: 2000-2005 Achievements: WWE Champion (1 Time), U.S. Champion (1 Time, First), Intercontinental Champion (2 Times), IWA Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), European Champion (2 Times), WWE Tag Team Champion (4 Times w/Chavo Guerrero, Rey Mysterio & Tajiri), WWE Hall of Fame Promotions Worked For: WWE, ROH, WCW, WWA, IWA Mid-South, Various Independents Why He's #18: I know this is going to be tough for some of you guys to handle, but let's pretend for a second that Eddie Guerrero hasn't died and WWE hasn't exaggerated his legend for the sake of profit. Let's just forget sentimentality. Eddie Guerrero was one of the most complete performers in wrestling. Rey Mysterio could fly high, but Eddie could fly high and wrestle. Benoit could wrestle, but Eddie could wrestle and talk. Cena could talk, but Eddie could talk and wrestle and fly. See my point? Inside or out of the ring, Eddie was always entertaining. Eddie wasn't a perfect person by any measure, but he loved wrestling fans, even his detractors, and gave his heart for our entertainment. While it is foolish to pretend that Eddie didn't have real problems, I believe that the love he had for performing and for the fans who watched him perform covers up a multitude of sins.
While Eddie started the decade as a WCW employee and had a cup of coffee in Ring of Honor at its earliest shows, most of the time was spent in WWE. In his first year, Eddie got himself over with humorous segments involving Chyna, proving he was more than a good mechanic, and won three championships in the process. When he returned to WWE in 2002, he made an instant impact, winning the Intercontinental Championship from Rob Van Dam in a feud that culminated with a ladder match on RAW. Eddie would go to Smackdown and form a team with his nephew Chavo Guerrero, and as part of the Smackdown Six gave fans some of the best free wrestling ever witnessed. The Guerreros deserve extra credit as they helped carry the tag team division after that golden period, feuding with the World's Greatest Tag Team and the Basham Brothers. But 2003 would also be the year that Eddie broke out as a singles star.
When WWE decided to bring the United States Championship to Smackdown! as a secondary title, it was Eddie who was given the first run with it. He did an admirable job carrying the belt, defending it against Chris Benoit and John Cena before losing it to the Big Show. While Eddie helped give the belt some credibility, the title also boosted Eddie's stock. Fans had grown enamored with Eddie's "Lie, Cheat & Steal" persona and he became the most over wrestler on Smackdown! Appropriately, Eddie defeated Brock Lesnar for the world title in something of an upset, in an emotional rollercoaster ride of a match. Out of all the wrestlers that could have walked into Wrestlemania XX as champion, it was Eddie Guerrero, who successfully defended his title that night. Eddie's run was one of the few bright spots in a down year for the blue brand, and he continued to be a top challenger for the belt after losing it to JBL. Eddie would spend most of 2005 in a personal feud with Rey Mysterio, coming out on the losing end in every match but the penultimate cage match. His last major storyline was a friendship/rivalry with Batista that seemed to set him up for a run as World Champion. Tragically, Eddie passed unexpectedly before that could happen. He has left a legacy of in-ring quality and love for fans that still lives on. Why He Isn't Any Higher: Eddie missed most of 2001 because his drug issues got so out of hand that WWE was forced to fire him. While Eddie did come back, after swearing off alcohol and painkillers, (steroids were another story, but who cares about steroids in a fake sport) he ultimately paid the price for his poor decisions and passed away in 2005. With only half the decade to work with, Eddie can only rank so high on this list before wrestlers with more longevity, world titles, and quality matches surpass him.
#17: Rey Mysterio
Active Years: 2000-2009 Achievements: World Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), Intercontinental Champion (2 Times), Cruiserweight Champion (3 Times), WWC Junior Heavyweight Champion, WCW Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Juventud Guerrera), WWE Tag Team Champion (4 Times w/Edge, Eddie Guerrero, Batista & Rob Van Dam), WCW Cruiserweight Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Billy Kidman, Last), Royal Rumble 2006 Promotions Worked For: WWE, WCW, CMLL, XWF, IWA Mid-South, WWC Why He's #17: Rey Mysterio embodies the philosophy that it isn't the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog. Rey has said that he's never been in the ring with a wrestler smaller than him, but that hasn't stopped him from being a huge success. Since coming to the WWE in 2002, Rey Mysterio has been one of the top stars in the promotion. While the Rey-love from the IWC stopped sometime in 2006, around the time he became World Champion, it is hard to overestimate Rey's value to WWE. He is a top draw for two of WWE's most important markets: the ever-increasing Hispanic audience, who have someone who represents their culture in Rey, and children, who will always cheer for the underdog that flies around in a mask like Superman. Because of that, Rey has always been featured on the card and is a priority for WWE.
In 2002, Rey made an immediate impact, teaming with Edge as part of the Smackdown Six and having the match of the year with Edge against Chris Benoit and Kurt Angle. In 2003 and 2004, he was used as a centerpiece for the cruiserweight division, feuding with the likes of Matt Hardy, Tajiri, Jamie Noble and Chavo Guerrero. He also found time to form an exciting and innovative tag team with Rob Van Dam that always seem to be forgotten about when talking about great super teams. In 2005, he formed another dream team with Eddie Guerrero before feuding with him, getting the victory in match after match, including a terrific ladder match at Summer Slam. In the wake of Eddie's death, Mysterio formed a short team with Batista before starting his road to the World Championship, winning the Royal Rumble before defeating Kurt Angle and Randy Orton for the belt at Wrestlemania XXII. Rey's title run would be highlighted with a victory over JBL and a great showcase against Sabu at the second One Night Stand.
Rey lost the title to King Booker due to Chavo Guerrero's help, and the two began their most violent and personal rivalry yet, that only ended when Chavo won an "I Quit" Match on Smackdown. The next year would be marred with injuries, although he would briefly challenge former partner Edge for the World Championship before suffering another injury. On RAW, Rey battled Kane and more injuries before having a very good match with CM Punk at Armageddon. 2009 marked a career resurgence, as Rey gave a great performance in an Elimination Chamber and nearly became WWE Champion, and then won the Intercontinental Championship and retired JBL in the process. Rey would have an amazing feud with Chris Jericho and have a mask vs. title match with him at the Bash that has sadly been forgotten about in Match of the Year talk. After that, Rey successfully defended his championship against Dolph Ziggler before losing an incredible match to John Morrison. Rey is proof that bigger isn't always better. Why He Isn't Any Higher: Rey was perhaps the worst booked World Champion in history, as he spent most of his time jobbing to men like Kane and The Great Khali. Even against competition closer to his size, like Sabu and Kurt Angle, he still couldn't get any wins. Rey has also been plagued with injuries for his entire career. While Rey winning the World Title was nice, it was obviously a vanity run because of Eddie's passing. Rey has had a hard time building up any good will after that.
#16: Kenta Kobashi
Active Years: 2000-2009 Achievements: GHC Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), AJPW Triple Crown Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), GHC Openweight Hardcore Champion (1 Time), GHC Tag Team Champion (2 Times w/Tamon Honda), Champions Carnival 2000 Promotions Worked For: NOAH, AJPW, ROH Why He's #16: The highest ranked Japanese competitor on this list. Kobashi has achieved an almost-god like status in his own country, and has earned the respect of every person who has seen him. Were it not for the typical American fan's refusal to accept that anything outside of the WWE has any value, Kobashi would be universally praised as one of the all-time greats. Possessing strength, speed, skill, heart and an incredible ability to connect with his audience, Kobashi has been called "The Perfect Wrestler". And while he had been universally praised by anyone who had seen more than a handful of his classics, and was every bit the wrestler Misawa was in his prime, it seemed like Kobashi might never get a lengthy title reign as the unquestioned #1 wrestler of a company. In All-Japan, the style was changing and legends like Keiji Mutoh and Genichiro Tenryu were coming in to run the place. And when NOAH started, Kobashi's knees were so shot from the toll of his career that he had to stand by and let Misawa and Akiyama carry the company.
In 2003, Kobashi had what many called his last chance to be a World Champion when he challenged Misawa for the GHC Heavyweight Championship. After almost forty grueling minutes, Kobashi put away Misawa with the Burning Hammer and what was rightfully his. What followed was a two year reign that stands as the longest world title run by any wrestler on this list. Kobashi took on challengers from any company, of all sizes and styles, running the gamut from legends to up and comers. And they all fell at his feet, as Kobashi proved his dominance of puroresu. His most famous rivalries were with Jun Akiyama and Kensuke Sasaki, with whom he had two of the best matches of the decade with. Eventually, Kobashi would fall to Takashi Rikio. Since then, his biggest contribution to wrestling has been going to ROH for two shows. At the first, he wrestled Samoa Joe in a match that brought more positive publicity to Ring of Honor than any before it. At the second, he teamed with Homicide to face Joe and Kow Ki in a tag team dream match. Kobashi is one of the last people in the world that needed to make an appearance for a company that will probably never break 3,000 fans, but that gesture is a symbol of how much Kobashi loves this business. Kobashi has had a rough last half of the decade but is still one of the top draws in NOAH, and isn't out of the realm of possibility that he will be a World Champion one more time before he puts the boots up for good. Why He Isn't Any Higher: While Kobashi didn't fall as far as Misawa did, his best in-ring days were behind him in the 1990's. It's not so much that his quality dipped off as that he started relying on formula, much like Ric Flair started doing in the late 1980's. "Typical Kobashi Match" is not an insult, because the typical Kobashi match is excellent. But it's still the same match over and over and most of them kind of run together. Kobashi's ranking also suffers from cancer taking him out of wrestling for a good while, and knee problems before that. Kobashi has taken things a little more slowly, playing the part of special attraction, and given what has happened to Misawa recently, slowing things down is the wisest course of action for a legend who deserves a long and happy life.
#15: Rob Van Dam
Active Years: 2000-2007 Achievements: WWE Champion (1 Time), ECW Champion (1 Time, First), ECW Television Champion (1 Time), Intercontinental Champion (6 Times), Hardcore Champion (4 Times, Last), European Champion (1 Time, Last), WWE Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Rey Mysterio), World Tag Team Champion (2 Times w/Booker T & Kane), AWR Heavyweight Champion (2 Times), Mr. Money in the Bank 2006 Promotions Worked For: WWE, ECW, Various Independents Why He's #15: Rob Van Dam entered the decade as the longest reigning Television Champion in ECW and the company's top draw. In many ways, Rob Van Dam was just like Bryan Danielson would become a few years later: an extremely talented athlete tearing up the wrestling underground with quality matches. Sadly, ECW was not long for the world and RVD would have to look for success elsewhere. He found that success in WWE, where he was signed as part of the WCW-ECW Alliance that challenged the WWE in its Invasion Angle. While most people consider the Invasion to have bombed, most agree that RVD's signing was a great thing that came out of it. WWE realized they had a valuable commodity on their hands and immediately put him in a feud with Jeff Hardy for the Hardcore Championship. As Hardcore Champion, RVD was able to show off everything that made him a cult favorite in ECW and show it to a worldwide audience that was equally receptive. Within five months of his debut, RVD was one of the most popular babyfaces in the company (as a heel) and was entrenched in the main event scene. Sadly, it would be five years before Van Dam became a World Champion.
Van Dam spent 2002 and 2003 on the RAW brand, usually competing for the Intercontinental Championship, having great ladder matches with Guerrero and Christian. He had a brief attempt to take the World Championship from Triple H and formed to championship teams with Kane and Booker T. In 2004, he would be traded to Smackdown! Some thought the change of scenery and the lack of depth in the main event scene would allow RVD to be pushed to World Title status, but he spent most of his time teaming with Rey Mysterio and facing Rene Dupree and Kenzo Suzuki. An injury would put Van Dam on the shelf for most of 2005, and he was unable to compete at ECW One Night Stand. RVD would return at the Royal Rumble 2006, and was finally pushed to his potential. At Wrestlemania 22, Mr. Monday Night would become Mr. Money in the Bank. And after a brief feud with Shelton Benjamin which saw RVD become a six-time Intercontinental Champion, RVD was ready to cash it in.
At One Night Stand 2006, Rob Van Dam battled John Cena in the Hammerstein Balllroom for the WWE Championship, in front of the most partisan crowd I have ever seen. To say Rob Van Dam was the overwhelming favorite would not do it justice. While it took some shady circumstances involving Edge and Paul Heyman, RVD would walk as WWE Champion that night. By nature of winning a championship from Cena, RVD was also awarded the newly reinstated ECW Championship, making him a dual champion, although he would lose the WWE Title to Edge and the ECW Title to The Big Show. RVD was a top contender to the championship for the rest of his run. His last big feud was a part of the ECW Originals (with Sabu, Sandman & Tommy Dreamer) against the New Breed (Elijah Burke, Marcus Cor Von, Kevin Thorn & Matt Striker), and he would win the match for his team at Wrestlemania 23, going 4-0 at the Big Dance. RVD also had a brief rivalry with Randy Orton that was used as a way to send him out of the company in style. Since then, RVD has been wrestling for various independents and made a "One Shot Deal" appearance at the Royal Rumble 2009.
Rob Van Dam is perhaps the most unique wrestler on this list as far as his in-ring style goes. A mixture of martial arts, gymnastics, and a little bit of technical wrestling and brawling, RVD is a huge benefit to any card because he will provide something different from what the other wrestlers are doing. While some people mock him for "doing highspots and pointing at himself", no one can deny that this style excited crowds and set him apart from the typical WWE wrestler. RVD refused to conform and became very popular for it. He truly was "One of a Kind". Why He Isn't Any Higher: To say RVD's WWE Championship run was a failure would be an understatement. After a marijuana scandal, RVD lost both of his titles in the span of two days and was suspended for thirty days. RVD took five years rise to the top of WWE and five weeks to fall right back down. RVD has also spent the last two and a half years in semi-retirement, missed most of 2005 due to an injury and significant portion of 2001 with an injury. RVD seems to have the worst look in wrestling. Yes, some of it he brought upon himself, but some of it just happened.
#14: Jeff Hardy
Active Years: 2000-2009 Achievements: WWE Champion (1 Time), World Heavyweight Champion (2 Times), Intercontinental Champion (4 Times), European Champion (1 Time), Hardcore Champion (3 Times), Light Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), WCW Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Matt Hardy), World Tag Team Champion (6 Times w/Matt Hardy), Various Independent Titles Promotions Worked For: WWE, TNA, ROH, Various Independents Why He's #14: Very few wrestlers have given fans greater highs and greater lows than Jeff Hardy. At times, his star has burned brightly and other times it seemed like it would never shine again. He and his brother Matt are legends in Tag Team Wrestling, and their three-way feud with Edge and Christian and the Dudley Boyz. Together, the three teams created a tag-team renaissance and invented an entirely new genre of match, the TLC Match. With all due respect to the other five men, Jeff Hardy was the star of these matches, with his Swanton Bombs off of twenty-foot ladders providing moments that are will be on highlight reels for years. Jeff earned a massive fan base for his daredevil antics (it certainly wasn't for his promo ability), a fan base made up of skinny guys who finally had someone their size making waves in wrestling, and of teenage girls. Along with Edge, Jeff was pegged to be a future world champion even as far back as 2000, but it would be another eight years before that came to fruition.
In 2002, Jeff Hardy wrestled the Undertaker in a ladder match for the WWE Championship and came within inches of winning the title, and he earned Taker's respect in the process. Sadly, this would be the last highlight of Jeff's career for many years. He became more and more erratic and his performances were far from what they once were. In 2003, he was released by WWE, and would not return until late 2006. In the meantime, Jeff made an appearance at an ROH show and was booed out of the building. He found a little more success in TNA, having a dream match with AJ Styles and challenging Jeff Jarrett for the NWA Championship at their first PPV before having a lengthy feud with Abyss. But this time was marked by the same sketchy behavior, and while Jeff could still excite a crowd, he was a laughing stock on the internet. The mighty had fallen very, very far.
But Jeff became WWE's version of the prodigal son, returning in 2006 and having a tremendous feud with Johnny Nitro over the Intercontinental Championship, which segued to a Hardy Boyz reunion and a feud with MNM. At Wrestlemania 23, Jeff was back to his show-stealing ways, putting Edge through a ladder in an incredible leap. The Hardyz would have one of the last great tag team feuds in WWE with Lance Cade & Trevor Murdoch, and Hardy would start a feud with Umaga. Then came Cyber Sunday 2006. While Shawn Michaels won the fan vote to face Randy Orton, Hardy was a very close second. WWE capitalized on the momentum and put him in a friendly rivalry with Triple H, and Jeff got an upset win at Armageddon against the Game (and is, as of today, the last person to cleanly beat Triple H in a singles match), which started an incredible chase to Randy Orton's title, highlighted by jumping off the Raw set onto Orton and a great cage match with Umaga. Jeff would lose that match to Orton but would also beat Shawn Michaels on RAW.
Jeff would be traded to Smackdown in the middle of 2008, and arguably the most popular babyface of Smackdown! (with Triple H and Undertaker also in contention). His rivalry with Triple H continued and produced some very fine matches that proved that Hardy could wrestle WWE's main event style. After another memorable match with Taker, Hardy would finally achieve his dream by beating Edge and Triple H for the WWE Championship in an incredible moment. He would lose the title to Edge thanks to interference from his jealous brother and battled him in a feud, with Matt winning the Wrestlemania Match but losing the Backlash rematch. Jeff renewed acquaintances with Edge and defeated him in a Ladder Match for the World Championship before CM Punk cost him that title. Punk and Hardy had an incredible feud over the World Title and their opposing lifestyles, and Hardy's last match for WWE was a losing effort to CM Punk in a cage match. Jeff leaving was a blow that Smackdown! hasn't recovered from yet, but he helped put over two of WWE's most promising young stars in Punk and John Morrison before leaving. Why He Isn't Any Higher: While there is an argument to be made that personal and professional lives should be kept separate, it is virtually impossible to do with Hardy, because his personal demons have adversely affected his professional career. In 2000, Jeff Hardy was the hottest prospect in WWE, but his problems got him fired three years later, and it was not until the tail end of 2008 that Hardy finally made good on his potential. If not for his personal problems, Jeff may very well have been the top star in the WWE, a position currently held by John Cena. However, WWE fans are a forgiving bunch and will embrace Jeff if he comes back.
#13: Batista
Active Years: 2000-2009 Achievements: WWE Champion (1 Time), World Heavyweight Champion (4 Times), OVW Heavyweight Champion (1 Times), WWE Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Rey Mysterio), World Tag Team Champion (3 Times w/Ric Flair & John Cena), Royal Rumble 2005 Promotions Worked For: WWE, OVW Why He's #13: Did anyone really see Batista coming when he debuted as Deacon Batista? I mean, besides Jim Cornette? When he was in Evolution, he played "The Enforcer" role, and Arn Anderson, legend that he is, never became a World Champion. And WWE didn't really seem intent on pushing Batista. Randy Orton was the chosen one, the future of the business, the next top heel (a role he would eventually attain). But when Orton's face turned flopped (big time), the fans started to gravitate towards the big man. In one of the best long term angles done by WWE in a while, Batista started to have a conflict of interests between defending Triple H's World Title and becoming Champion himself. In 2005, he started steamrolling through the RAW Roster, dominating in an Elimination Chamber and winning the Royal Rumble. After putting Triple H through a table to cement his face turn, Batista would become World Champion in the main event of Wrestlemania 21, and would retain his title in two rematches with The Game, including a brutal Hell in a Cell that stands as Batista's best match to date.
Batista was sent to Smackdown! and continued his dominance against John Bradshaw Layfield and against Eddie Guerrero before finally succumbing to an injury. Batista returned in mid-2006 in a feud with Booker T, a feud he would come out of the victor. Batista defended against then rising star Ken Kennedy before facing his greatest challenge yet: The Undertaker. Batista's rivalry with the Undertaker produced some of the finest power-based matches in WWE history, and Batista became one of a select few to defeat the Deadman cleanly at Cyber Sunday 2007. In 2008, the Animal was unable to become #1 Contender to Edge's title shot despite a valiant effort at No Way Out's Elimination Chamber and settled for beating Umaga at Wrestlemania XXIV. After the match, Batista had a personal issue with Shawn Michaels, who had retired Dave's mentor Ric Flair at the Granddaddy of Them All. Batista would emphatically end that feud in a stretcher match. Batista was traded to RAW shortly thereafter and faced John Cena in an epic battle at Summer Slam, a match which Batista won.
Batista spent the rest of his time on RAW in something of a flux. While he had short title reigns at the expense of Chris Jericho and Randy Orton, The Animal was plagued by injuries that kept him keeping any momentum he got going. Batista is now back on Smackdown! and has turned heel for the first time in years and is currently tormenting former running buddy Rey Mysterio in between challenging Taker for his title. Since becoming a champion in 2005, Batista has either held the World Title or been the top contender for most of his run, with only injuries and personal vendettas keeping him away from the gold. Few can match the dominance Batista has enjoyed. And while few saw his rise to the top, everybody can see that he will stay on top as long as he wants. Why He Isn't Any Higher: Well, this is "wrestlers" of the decade. And Batista can't wrestle his way out of a paper bag. Of course, when you can rip the paper bag apart, there's no real point in trying to use finesse to escape. Batista's one dimensional power offense may get the job done in the ring, but it certainly hasn't endeared him to wrestling purists. Then again, he doesn't have John Cena's level of fan hatred either. Batista's career has also seen many injuries that are almost as frequent as his title victories.
#12: CM Punk
Active Years: 2000-2009 Achievements: World Heavyweight Champion (3 Times), ROH World Champion (1 Time), ECW Champion (1 Time), Intercontinental Champion (1 Time), OVW Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), OVW Television Champion (1 Time), IWA Heavyweight Champion (5 Times), IWA Light Heavyweight Champion (2 Times), World Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Kofi Kingston), ROH World Tag Team Champion (2 Times w/Colt Cabana), OVW Southern Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Seth Skyfire), Various Independent Championships Promotions Worked For: WWE, ROH, TNA, OVW IWA: Mid-South, Various American Independents Why He's #12: It is very difficult to come up with an original character in professional wrestling, as almost every stereotype has been used at some point. That's why CM Punk made such waves on the Independent Scene. Yes, he was famous for having TLCs and 90-Minute Matches with Chris Hero. And yes, Eddie Guerrero was so impressed with his in-ring skill that he personally chose him to drop the IWA Championship too. But CM Punk became a star because of his unique gimmick, one that he takes from his legitimate Straight-Edge beliefs. When Punk started to cut promos about how Raven reminded him of his alcoholic father, and the resulting bloody and violent feud between the two put the wrestling world on notice. Punk was a man to watch.
CM Punk would team with Colt Cabana to produce quality matches and quality promo segments to become one of the best teams in the company, and their matches with the Briscoe Brothers are considered classics. Punk would achieve further fame in Ring of Honor with his incredible trilogy with Samoa Joe, a series which saw two sixty-minute draws, one of which is called the greatest match in ROH history (and that's saying a lot) before Joe finally beat Punk. Punk would finally win the ROH World Title from Austin Aries in front of an adoring crowd. Punk then turn heel and the infamous "Summer of Punk" began, as Punk threatened to take the ROH Title to WWE before losing the title to James Gibson in a match that also involved Samoa Joe and Christopher Daniels. Punk had his last match as part of the regular ROH roster with Cabana, once again a fan favorite.
CM Punk got lucky when it came to signing with WWE. Paul Heyman knows a money gimmick when he sees it, and Punk was allowed to keep both his name and his straight-edge character. He dominated OVW, winning all of the promotions titles before being called up to the new ECW, where he debuted at the Hammerstein Ballroom to another adoring crowd. Punk quickly became one of the most popular acts on ECW and even earned himself a shot at Money in the Bank at his first Wrestlemania. After a brief heel turn, Punk became the top guy in ECW, feuding with Elijah Burke and then John Morrison, from whom he won the ECW Title. At Wrestlemania XXIV, CM Punk won Money in the Bank, and in a memorable moment on RAW, cashed in the briefcase against Edge to win his first World Championship. Punk's first reign was anything but stellar, and he wasn't even involved in the match he lost it in. Still, Punk's resume grew as he became a World Tag Team Champion with Kofi Kingston and won the Intercontinental Championship before becoming Mr. Money in the Bank for the second year in a row. But this time, Punk didn't cash in on a hated heel, but a beloved babyface named Jeff Hardy.
Punk became a full-fledged heel in his program with Jeff Hardy, and was finally allowed to show the WWE Universe the promo skills that ROH fans had raved about for years. The two were made to feud with each other, as Jeff had well publicized issues with drugs and CM Punk was straight-edge and could condemn Jeff for his actions, playing the part of the controversial preacher. Some people hated what Punk said about Jeff. Some loved it. Some loved what he said but hated how he said it. But everyone knew he was right, and that's what makes the character work. 2009 was filled with more great moments courtesy of CM Punk than I care to count. It's been a bumpy road for the Straight-Edge Superstar, but one well worth the drive. Punk is so many things. An incredibly versatile wrestler who can work multiple styles. A fantastic speaker who says what he says with more conviction than any other man in wrestling, because he truly believes it. But most of all, he is an argument that what worked on the independent scene can work in the big leagues. The future is still bright for CM Punk. Why He Isn't Any Higher: WWE has been kind of…weird…when it comes to booking CM Punk. On one hand, they book a masterpiece of a feud with Jeff Hardy, letting CM Punk channel his straight-edge beliefs against the perfect foil and become one of the most hated men in wrestling. And then there is no follow-up. Punk is never given a chance to spread his wings as a promo-man. Yes, the anti-drug promos are great, but not when you hear him say the same thing EVERY week. They know how to start a push, they just don't know how to sustain a push. Punk also suffers from a lot of his accomplishments happening in ROH, and he left before the company really started making huge waves. Being an ROH Champion in 2005 meant a lot less than being an ROH Champion in 2008.
#11: Randy Orton
Active Years: 2000-2009 Achievements: World Heavyweight Champion (1 Time), WWE Champion (5 Times), Intercontinental Champion (1 Time), OVW Hardcore Champion (2 Times), World Tag Team Champion (1 Time w/Edge), Royal Rumble 2009 Promotions Worked For: WWE, OVW Why He's #11: It is said that some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon them. In the case of Randall Keith Orton, all three apply. Born the son of "Cowboy" Bob Orton Jr. and the grandson of Bob Orton Sr., wrestling was in Randy's blood and he was destined to become one of the biggest stars in the profession. Indeed, Randy has reached greater heights than either his father or grandfather. In 2004, Randy had greatness thrust upon him when he became the youngest World Champion in WWE history, and he crumbled under the weight of it. But Orton has fought, clawed and bled his way to the top of the WWE, and has held the WWE Championship five times since 2007. Randy has achieved greatness in the form of becoming WWE's premier heel. A throwback to a bygone era where a heel's sole purpose was to make the fans hate him, Orton is utterly despised by WWE fans, marks and smarks alike. And he has become one of the top stars of the new millennium.
Randy has many people to thank. In 2003, he was handpicked as the future of the business by Ric Flair and Triple H and was a part of their stable Evolution. Orton became a legend killer, spitting in the faces of Harley Race and Sgt. Slaughter and defeating men like Shawn Michaels and Chris Benoit in the ring. An incredible and violent feud with Mick Foley solidified Orton as a man who could pay any check that his big mouth wrote. When he was cast aside by Evolution for winning the World Title, he charged full steam ahead against his former running buddies. He spent most of 2005 battling The Undertaker, a sign that he was as reckless as ever. It paid off as Orton became a top star on Smackdown!, battling Rey Mysterio and Kurt Angle at Wrestlemania 22. Orton would return to RAW and feud with Hulk Hogan before forming a partnership of convenience with Edge. But that was about to come to an end. Orton was ready to fly solo.
In 2007, Orton punted Shawn Michaels and put him out for months. He did the same to Rob Van Dam, who hasn't been a regular part of the WWE roster since. It was all part of a radical change in Orton's demeanor. Gone was the bravado and the smile, replaced with a silent menace and a cold stare. The only time smile on Orton's face was a sadistic one that came whenever he did incredible bodily harm to his opponents. The seriousness served Orton well, as he had a long title run with the WWE Championship, surviving challenges by Shawn Michaels, Jeff Hardy, Triple H and John Cena, by hook or by crook. When Orton took time off to heal from an injury, he picked off two followers in Cody Rhodes and Ted DiBiase. The three fight like pack animals, and Orton is the unquestioned alpha male. If anyone questions Orton, he will put them back in their place. Orton used the duo to help him win the Royal Rumble in 2009, a necessity after he punted Vince McMahon in the head. Orton has spent most of 2009 embroiled in rivalries with Triple H and John Cena, although he has recently been involved in a star-making feud with Kofi Kingston.
Orton was once a generic wrestler, but he is far from that now. Randy has adopted the "method acting" approach, and has totally lost himself in his character. The Orton that appears onscreen these days is not so much a man as an animal. Orton feels very few emotions: hunger for gold, fear of losing it, sick pleasure at hurting his enemies, both physically and emotionally, and a need for respect from his underlings. He has adopted every great heel philosophy. The ends justify the means. Live to fight another day. To break a man, break his heart. Do only what is necessary. Pick up the scraps. Orton's in-ring style might not be the flashiest, but it is the perfect example of a wrestler giving everything he has into his character. Not even 30 at the time of this writing, Orton could very well be a dominant force in the WWE for the next ten to twenty years. Why He Isn't Any Higher: Orton barely, barely misses the top ten, but it's for several good reasons. Orton has battled injuries for his entire career, not to mention behavioral issues. But the biggest detriment was his ill-fated face turn, a poorly thought out booking decision that took three years to recover from. Orton is now solidified as one of the top two heels in WWE, running neck and neck with Jericho, but it took a long road to get there. Orton misses the top ten because the ten wrestlers above him are either better wrestlers or have more accomplishments than him. Considering the ages of some of the wrestlers in the top ten, Orton will undoubtedly be in the top ten when people make similar lists in 2019
RVD is stretching it just to make the top 50, in my opinion.
Very surprised to see the druggie show up this 'high'.
Posted By: WOW (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:32 AM
in ur opening, #2 sure was rough on chavo and mvp, but u didnt really explain why those jap nobodies are on the list, other than the usual 'IT'S MORE THAN WWE' line.
Posted By: truereere (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:33 AM
Your reasoning is spot on for some of these guys....sure they may be talented and all, but they are in 'nothing promotions', thus they should be nowhere near this list.
I could tell you I put on 5 star matches every week in front of 100 neighborhood folk, but does it mean anything?
NO, of course not, but because high style moves and flippy foreign moves are flashy, they get attention.
Big bad WWE.....there is more to it than just them...yeah, sure there is.
Posted By: Industry (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:38 AM
Great list and great handling of all the racist, dumb morons in the comments section.
Posted By: Guest#4066 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 01:56 AM
Great to see Kobashi high on the list, excellent wrestler, easily top 10 of all time...
Posted By: Trev (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:03 AM
With what you said about Orton not making top ten,dont you fucking dare put cena up their,as he may "draw" flies to shit,no champ has ever been hated as a face so much as him,not even HH(I own the world title so fuck off)H or Undertaker and his(I take the title and bury who i want to bury) attitude.
Dont even fucking consider putting cena there.
Posted By: Showster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:49 AM
So we have Chris Jericho, HHH, HBK, Styles, Angle, Samoa Joe, Bryan Danielson, Edge, Undertaker and John Cena for the top 10? I'm not sure I agree with some of those being above Randy Orton, but I guess it makes sense.
Posted By: Josh (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 03:13 AM
Anyone that claims to be a wrestling fan that says Kobashi is a "jap nobody" needs to just jump off of a cliff right now. Maybe 411 needs to make a section called 411 Sports Entertainment for these fucking idiots.
Posted By: KX (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 03:41 AM
With what you said about Orton not making top ten,dont you fucking dare put cena up their,as he may "draw" flies to shit,no champ has ever been hated as a face so much as him,not even HH(I own the world title so fuck off)H or Undertaker and his(I take the title and bury who i want to bury) attitude.
Dont even fucking consider putting cena there.
Posted By: Showster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:49 AM
The criteria isnt what YOU personally approve or disapprove of. If it were, a douche filled hot-pocket would be #1 on this list.
Posted By: Guest#1442 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 03:56 AM
Orton at 11 is fucking criminal.
Posted By: WilliamMorgan (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:04 AM
another great read. well done.
Posted By: Csonkamaniac III (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:13 AM
With what you said about Orton not making top ten,dont you fucking dare put cena up their,as he may "draw" flies to shit,no champ has ever been hated as a face so much as him,not even HH(I own the world title so fuck off)H or Undertaker and his(I take the title and bury who i want to bury) attitude.
Dont even fucking consider putting cena there.
Posted By: Showster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:49 AM
That's right! Don't you dare put your own choices in your own column you big stinkyhead! =(
Posted By: boohooster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:40 AM
lol Nigel McGuinness this is ridiculious he is just an indy guy
Posted By: phat (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:46 AM
randy at 11? we see the evolution of randy orton, youngest world champ, his many Face/Heel segments.. his best work as a HEEL.. and hes 11?
RVD is way to high on this list
Posted By: wylun (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 05:10 AM
aj styles no1
Posted By: true (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 05:31 AM
"WWE finally seemed to have the right idea by putting him in the ring with Benoit to try and recreate the magic of the Best of Seven series, and with more time to work and more experience, their matches were actually better than the ones in WCW."
WHAT!!!?? Their WCW matches were better,jack.
Posted By: Z Man (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 05:47 AM
Gotta feeling Cena will be #1. Unfortunately.
Posted By: Y2G` (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 05:48 AM
Kobashi and Misawa are very far from nobodies. AJ had stable 6.0-8.0 rating on ntv in good days, they sold out arenas in Tokyo, Osaka etc, drawing thousands of people.
Posted By: verdu (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 06:01 AM
With what you said about Orton not making top ten,dont you fucking dare put cena up their,as he may "draw" flies to shit,no champ has ever been hated as a face so much as him,not even HH(I own the world title so fuck off)H or Undertaker and his(I take the title and bury who i want to bury) attitude.
Dont even fucking consider putting cena there.
Posted By: Showster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:49 AM
LOL U MAD
Posted By: Cena will be top (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 06:40 AM
There is a difference between being a WWE fan, a WCW fan, a TNA fan, a (insert random wrestler's name) fan and a WRESTLING FAN.
A wrestling fan enjoys WRESTLING, the ring work and the entertainment that comes from it and not the jokes and storylines.
Some of you don't know about Japanese wrestling... for shame, considering that a majority of the great moves you enjoy in today's North American wrestling comes from past years in Japan, along with the fact that it's the number 2-3 sport in the country. When was the WWE in the top five or 10 on the sports pages. ( Football, Baseball, basketball, Hockey, tennis, golf, Nascar, soccer, boxing and college sports are easily all ahead of WWE/TNA/ROH in north america)
Please refrain from needless racism and bigotry. It Only makes you look foolish and stupid.
Posted By: Bobbay (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 06:52 AM
Also I would probably push RVD further down the list.
Posted By: Bobbay (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 06:54 AM
Where is Shinsuke Nakamura?! Youve got Tanahashi on the list!!!
Batista at 13? Really?
Posted By: CL1 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 07:45 AM
No way in hell Randy Orton is only #11 on the list. AJ Styles, Kurt Angle, Chris Jericho, Randy Orton, and (gasp) HHH are the top 5 wrestlers of this decade.
Posted By: miles berg (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 08:50 AM
With what you said about Orton not making top ten,dont you fucking dare put cena up their,as he may "draw" flies to shit,no champ has ever been hated as a face so much as him,not even HH(I own the world title so fuck off)H or Undertaker and his(I take the title and bury who i want to bury) attitude.
Dont even fucking consider putting cena there.
Posted By: Showster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:49 AM
Well, I didn't see Cena on the other lists so he is on the next one. Get over it man, it's Hubbard's opinion so write your own.
Posted By: Guest#3639 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 09:06 AM
Having read through most of reasonsings for placings, only one man should come top and his name is HHH.
RVD was super high (pun intended) on the list considering he bottled his big chance.
Posted By: caboose (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 09:31 AM
This list blows godboy.
Posted By: Jim Belushi is my mom (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 10:32 AM
RVD I always thought looked sloppy in the ring. Overrated!
Posted By: T-Mac (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 10:34 AM
Great write-up about Orton. Totally seeing him in a different light now, kudos.
Posted By: JMAC (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:05 AM
Very surprised to see the druggie show up this 'high'.
Posted By: WOW (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:32 AM
I don't think anything makes me happier than watching you fags hating on people for being able to do drugs and still succeed in life. It's amazing what misinformation and ignorance will do. I wonder how many people have to become successful while smoking cannabis before people realize maybe it's not as bad as the government makes it out to be.
Posted By: 420 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:20 AM
RVD was not the first ECW champion. Man, it's sad how you guys always try to keep the old and the new ECW apart.
Posted By: Guest#6590 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:27 AM
Being a ROH Champion never meant anything. It's just another worthless indie belt no one except for fat nerds give s a damn about.
Posted By: Guest#3057 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:32 AM
Considering you placed green indy noobs and asian unknowns above the Rock and Stone Cold makes this list an epic, epic failure.
However, all will be forgotten if AND ONLY IF Chris Jericho is #1.
Posted By: Make it so (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:51 AM
Aaron, great line about Batista ripping his way out of a paper bag and it's true.
Posted By: The Great Capt. Smooth (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:02 PM
So where are the Luchadores? Some of the European scene I'm hearing about? This is 411 WRESTLING, right? You remind me of one of those wine snobs who can recite a few lines to impress people in the room who know nothing about the topic, but when your lack of depth in knowledge is exposed, it shows you are really an idiot.
If this is just WWE/WCW, TNA, and Japan, then just leave it at THAT! Don't try and pretend you have a worldly view of this whole thing, when all you are is just staying one tier ahead of the common fan.
Posted By: Mike (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:19 PM
News Flash: Wrestling's biggest purpose is entertainment. I bet Austin would actually laugh with the guy that said he rolls around in his underwear. Or at least treat that person with more respect than he would you if you went in and started talking about workrates and spots and dropping all this socalled 'insider lingo" Fans like you get mocked and laughed at by those in the business. You're pathetic!
Posted By: Bob (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:24 PM
this list is complete shit. wrestling was at its absolute peak at the box office and in terms of quality when the rock was the man. In a three year span he and Austin got higher ratings, drew more money, and gave more memorable moments that cena, orton, batista, and triple H, all put together.
Posted By: uguyssuck (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:26 PM
I get the feeling HHH will be #1. This saddens me because he will be ahead of 3 of the greatest 10 wrestlers ever (HBK Jericho and Angle) and ahead of someone who is a bigger star without booking himself to do it (Cena). But hey, playing politics gets people far in life... Look at Taker, he is wrestling's Rene Descartes. His character is a Cartesian circle: I can't lose much because it ruins the mystique. What is the mystique? That I don't lose much.
Posted By: Jon (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:32 PM
Cena will be number one... I feel it. Him or Angle, but Cena has spent more time in the top fed and has had more time with the main event WWE title than Angle. I hate to say TNA is not important, but it just doesn't feel as impactful as WWE. I still feel that TNA should count for something, as should ROH, PWG, DGUSA, CHIKARA, and all the rest. But WWE is a big scale tipper.
P.S. Can I guess AJ at number 10?
Posted By: Kyle (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:39 PM
This is a great, well-reasoned list. I don't agree with every one, but who on earth would? The only one I am really contentious about is RVD. The majority of his WWE time was unremarkable. His win against Cena was a great moment, but it's his ONLY ONE.
Posted By: DaveP (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:45 PM
Edge should be top 5 but injuries will probably keep him out. top 5, hhh, angle, cena, hbk, taker.
Posted By: Joe (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:51 PM
While I do believe that RVD is one of, if not the, most overrated wrestler of all time, and should not even hold the spot he has on this list (or make this list at all), the rest of it has been basically spot on.
Of course, I think Orton deserves much more credit, but considering the top 10 will definitely include Edge and Jericho, this has been a great read so far.
Posted By: Guest#3667 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 01:22 PM
I was a HUGE RVD fan and I like where he is due to my fandom but he honestly doesn't deserve to be so high. Also there's NO way he or Jeff Hardy should be higher than Booker!
Posted By: MachoManFanStill (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 01:25 PM
Meant to add this was a great read. We're each entitled to our opinion and I look forward to the Top Ten.
Posted By: MachoManFanStill (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 01:29 PM
"hang with... Chris Benoit"? Too soon?
Posted By: Insensitive Prick (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 01:44 PM
The top ten is gonna be Cena, Taker, HHH, HBK, Jericho, Edge, Angle, Danielson, Samoa Joe, and Aj Styles, in any order.
So I can forgive Orton just missing out on the top ten. Considering that Orton really only became a solidified maineventer in late 2007, early 2008, and prior to that he was just an upper card threat to the title.
The only people you could really cut out of the list to get Orton higher are Danielson (which is very unlikely considering he's indie wrestlings golden boy), and AJ Styles.
The biggest fault Orton is gonna really have on this list is that Edge did the exact same thing as him earlier,better, and for a longer period of time. So you can't justify him being any higher than Edge would be, and I wouldn't be all that shocked to see Edge at numbers 10-8.
Number one imo is gonna be a toss up between Cena, HBK, Jericho, and HHH (hopefully not)
Posted By: J.J.T. (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:00 PM
Hubbard, thanks for the all work and thought you've clearly put into this. Never mind the 12 year olds on here who are incapable of disagreeing like adults. Some of you seriously need to get laid.
Also to 420: Even funnier knowing that RVD's drug of choice is the only one not killing wrestlers before their time.
Think Eddie would be alive today if he were only toking up? Yep.
How about Benoit...too much weed made him do what he did right? LOL, not quite.
The list goes on and on.
Posted By: Santos L Halper (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:18 PM
Goldberg Goldberg Goldberg.He had one of the biggest comebacks in wrestling history with the rock.he better be on there or alot of people won't be coming back too this site.
Posted By: druggie (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:20 PM
The big question: will Chris Benoit be in the Top 10?
Posted By: Chris (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:40 PM
their is no list on this planet that should have Batista above Kobashi! except oldest greenhorn!
Posted By: Guest#7935 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:41 PM
My mistake - he was number 27.
Posted By: Chris (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:44 PM
For those complaining about Orton's placement. Keep in mind he wasn't the top performer in the company. For the majority of his wwe tenure he wasn't in must must see matches, or storylines. His injuries have kept him on the sidelines for 1/3 of his 7 years on WWE tv.
Posted By: K. Bett (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 03:00 PM
Randy Orton never got any **** match, so he don't have to make the top 10.
And we can easily find 10 wrestlers who get pretty better than Orton during the 10 last years.
Posted By: Wooooo (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 03:05 PM
i hate orton...but come on,not even in the top ten...come on man,write down this list,sit down,take a look at it,fold it up,turn that bitch sideways...and stick it straight up your candy ass
Posted By: jay (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 03:37 PM
Goldberg Goldberg Goldberg.He had one of the biggest comebacks in wrestling history with the rock.he better be on there or alot of people won't be coming back too this site.
Posted By: druggie (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 02:20 PM
I'm not sure which is funnier.. that you would suggest Goldberg belongs on this list.. or that you think people care enough about the list to base their surfing on it.
If you didnt visit this forum, you'd lose out on the troll-bitching that keeps your ego alive and your life so rich and flavorful.
Posted By: Guest#7399 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 03:46 PM
Very surprised to see the druggie show up this 'high'.
Posted By: WOW (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:32 AM
I don't think anything makes me happier than watching you fags hating on people for being able to do drugs and still succeed in life. It's amazing what misinformation and ignorance will do. I wonder how many people have to become successful while smoking cannabis before people realize maybe it's not as bad as the government makes it out to be.
Yes sir, they both succeeded so well that Hardy is in court and RVD no longer works hardly anywhere. Sure he's still over, but they're proof positive that without the drugs, they would both still be HUGE forces in WWE, and be making a shit ton more money. But yeah, they're still successful...
Posted By: All Around Wrestling Fan (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 03:49 PM
I don't think you can have it both ways. If columns on this site such as this one want to focus on mainstream American product such as WWE & TNA then that's fine. I wont read it, but that's fine because then you will have some clear parameters. However, if you're going to acknowledge that there is wrestling outside of those two (and that it's often far superior) then I think it's a bit silly to pick and choose. You hate Lucha Libre? That's akin to a wrestling fan saying, 'I hate catcher's catch can', or 'I hate Memphis style', or 'I hate strong style'. If you like wrestling it's like enjoying ice cream. You get a multitude of flavors. Some you like much more than others, but you still like ice cream. And you may really dislike one flavor and would never order it, but it's still ice cream so you should respect it as such. In other words, saying Mistico doesn't make the cut because you don't like lucha renders this list meaningless. That would be like me writing the colum and saying I cant stand Triple H or Cena (and I can't) and then leaving two of the top stars of the decade off the list because of it.
Posted By: DocSarpolis (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:02 PM
Same ridiculous bullshit. You are totally inconsistent.
When you rate the indy guys you talk about workrate and technical prowess. When you talk about the WWE guys you talk about business and industry.
You basically took the guys you like and stuck them in whatever order you saw fit.
Its YOUR column but man this wouldve been more interesting if you'd got input from more than just writer on this site.
Posted By: Guest#2968 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:49 PM
I'd put everybody on this list above CM Punk. CM is not better than Batista, Jeff Hardy, RVD, Rey or Eddie.
Posted By: iomis (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:50 PM
Gotta believe the top spot will go to either Triple H, Cena or Angle. Its crazy that Angle DEBUTED at the '99 survivor series, so everything Kurt has accomplished(in the pro world) has been this decade.
Also, i think Benoit should have probably been ranked a bit higher. Hes at least top 20.
10)Samoa Joe
9)Bryan Danielson
8)Shawn Michaels
7)Undertaker
6)Chris Jericho
5)Edge
4)AJ Styles
3)Triple H
2)Kurt Angle
1)John Cena
Posted By: just sayin (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:54 PM
Jeff Hardy and Batista higher than NIGEL FUCKING MCGUINESS!? Come on. Really? REALLY? lol.
Posted By: Yup. (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 05:12 PM
After just looking it up, I can't believe Cena is a 5 time WWE Champion and a 2 time World Champion, that seems way too many for someone with so little talent.
Posted By: Gorsty (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 05:42 PM
Truereere, please do me a favour and drop dead right now. Your ignorance to the wrestling World pains me.
Posted By: PX (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 06:42 PM
It's cool Aaron: Between the marks,
Smarks -Trekkies,only beefier(c)- workers, and office commenting, you can't please ANYONE. Yet, you've got EVERYONE commenting, so good for you. And yeah,
I agree with about 17% of your ratings.
Rock-on, bro.
Posted By: HisPrinceMichael (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 06:49 PM
The rock had more impact, better matches, and was more entertaining than all of the above guys put together. He headlined more wrestlemanias than any of the above. Your list is shit hubbard. Hbk, angle, cena, should be your top three for sure - those are the guys who have headlined multiple wrestlemanias without having to fuck the bosses daughter, and have excelled on all other fronts.
Posted By: Guest#0524 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 07:31 PM
I don't think you can have it both ways. If columns on this site such as this one want to focus on mainstream American product such as WWE & TNA then that's fine. I wont read it, but that's fine because then you will have some clear parameters. However, if you're going to acknowledge that there is wrestling outside of those two (and that it's often far superior) then I think it's a bit silly to pick and choose. You hate Lucha Libre? That's akin to a wrestling fan saying, 'I hate catcher's catch can', or 'I hate Memphis style', or 'I hate strong style'. If you like wrestling it's like enjoying ice cream. You get a multitude of flavors. Some you like much more than others, but you still like ice cream. And you may really dislike one flavor and would never order it, but it's still ice cream so you should respect it as such. In other words, saying Mistico doesn't make the cut because you don't like lucha renders this list meaningless. That would be like me writing the colum and saying I cant stand Triple H or Cena (and I can't) and then leaving two of the top stars of the decade off the list because of it.
Posted By: DocSarpolis (Guest)
your point is meaningless by suggesting we should respect a ice-cream flavor we despise because it's ice-cream. I don't watch the Japanese feds but I'm kinda interested now because of the detailed way he's laying this all out. C'mon man, it's the 411 crowd, if there were Luchas included everyone would be freaking there are too many "nobodies" on this list. It's his list, a writer writes what he knows & I think it's a pretty good list. He doesn't watch the Lucha wrestling so why should he comment on it? if he did, you would jump on him for "not knowing what he's talking about". So, I can't believe I'm typing this, Hubbard knows what he's writing about.
Keep complaining & he'll bring back that wreslemania odyssey thing. Then no one wins.
I hate mint-chocolate chip ice-cream & have never respected it. The thought I should respect it, makes me despise it even more, thanks Doc....
Posted By: BlueOyster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 07:54 PM
I hope u guys remember... this list is someones OWN OPINION.... which means its not a real concrete list that will be cemented into history..
So love it or hate it... just enjoy it.. everyone has their own opinion nd I'm sure ppl will go ape shiot wen they see who number 1 is... but honestly some ppl have critisisms but some ppl r just plain out nasty nd there is no need for that here
Posted By: wylun (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 07:54 PM
Haha.Look at some of these fags getting bent out of shape over an internet column ranking of wrestlers.As much as i hate to say it HHH will be no.1 No one has had more world titles and been on top more in the past 10 years then him.
Posted By: murph (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 08:12 PM
Son of a gun, Orton is Top 10 for sure.
Posted By: Brad (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 08:25 PM
Same ridiculous bullshit. You are totally inconsistent.
When you rate the indy guys you talk about workrate and technical prowess. When you talk about the WWE guys you talk about business and industry.
You basically took the guys you like and stuck them in whatever order you saw fit.
Its YOUR column but man this wouldve been more interesting if you'd got input from more than just writer on this site.
Posted By: Guest#2968 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 04:49 PM
WHAT? You mean that SOME guys are on this list because of technical ability, while SOME guys are on the list because they helped the business as a whole by making $$$ in matches that werent technically demanding?
Wow man.. I xeen some bullshit in my day but that really takes the cake.
Posted By: Guest#7181 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 09:19 PM
Very surprised to see the druggie show up this 'high'.
Posted By: WOW (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:32 AM
I don't think anything makes me happier than watching you fags hating on people for being able to do drugs and still succeed in life. It's amazing what misinformation and ignorance will do. I wonder how many people have to become successful while smoking cannabis before people realize maybe it's not as bad as the government makes it out to be.
Posted By: 420 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:20 AM
A-fucking-men. Weed has never killed anyone. Just made them hungry and sleepy. Govt. sheep can pretend it's harmful but there is no evidence (partly because you can't study an illegal substance). METH IS DEATH POT IS NOT.
[Insert convenient CM Punk reference]
Oh, and I fully expect the #1 wrestler on this list to be Aldo Montoya.
Posted By: Ram Jam (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 09:38 PM
This has been a very interesting list.
Posted By: Comment Board Poster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 09:44 PM
i appreciate the lists n eveything but seriously, rvd higher than eddie is an automatic epic fail
Posted By: Guest#8033 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 10:15 PM
Very surprised to see the druggie show up this 'high'.
Posted By: WOW (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:32 AM
I don't think anything makes me happier than watching you fags hating on people for being able to do drugs and still succeed in life. It's amazing what misinformation and ignorance will do. I wonder how many people have to become successful while smoking cannabis before people realize maybe it's not as bad as the government makes it out to be.
Posted By: 420 (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:20 AM
___________________________________
Yes...because weed is the only drug Jeff Hardy has been busted with.
Posted By: MasterShake (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 10:44 PM
who will always cheer for the underdog that flies around in a mask like Superman
superman doesn't wear a mask. I know this shouldn't have bothered me so much, but it did.
Posted By: wrestlingsok (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:07 PM
My Olympic hero better be number fucking one.
Posted By: Jay Smith (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:50 PM
Orton should be top 5. He was and is a real force from almost the moment he arrived in WWE, and is arguably the best heel of the past 10 years.
Posted By: Me (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:55 PM
These lists seem to be all about quantity over quality, as long as you've been around a long time your jump ahead of REAL legends like Hulk Hogan, The Rock and Steve Austin.
When you think about this literally.... yes Nigel McGuinness had more impact than THE ROCK in this decade according to Mr Hubbard... I mean think about that for one second.
Honestly Aaron despite his 'knowledge' clearly thinks he's such a smart fan that he gave us this pretentious list.
GIVE US A F**KING LIST THAT ISN'T SMART related and that give us the TOP WRESTLERS OF THE DECADE the ones with the most impact and memorable moments.... not some japanese dudes who wrestled a ***** match in a bingo hall.
I've been coming to 411 for over 10 years now and we are literally down to 2 good writers. The rest have become so pathetically caught up in this smart arse bullshit overlooking the bigger picture of what and who is great.
Posted By: Andrew Barbarash (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:57 PM
I've been coming to 411 for over 10 years now and we are literally down to 2 good writers. The rest have become so pathetically caught up in this smart arse bullshit overlooking the bigger picture of what and who is great.
Posted By: Andrew Barbarash (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:57 PM
Who exactly is being pretentous here?
Posted By: Guest#8089 (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 12:10 AM
Goddamn, there's a lot of crybabies around here.
Posted By: Highscore Kid (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 12:28 AM
I bet Taker is #1. He's dominated the wrestling scene all decade, is one of the consistent draws, been in many 5 star matches, won top championships, gets cheered whereever he goes, and is the only WWE wrestler I know of who has managed to avoid all those slapstick skits. :) Cena and HBK are the only ones who come close in the WWE, but they didn't start wrestling this decade till 2002.
Posted By: y2kev (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 12:46 AM
CM Punk is as overated in IWC as is Marion in the internet gaming community.
Posted By: Juan (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 12:56 AM
GIVE US A F**KING LIST THAT ISN'T SMART related and that give us the TOP WRESTLERS OF THE DECADE the ones with the most impact and memorable moments.... not some japanese dudes who wrestled a ***** match in a bingo hall.
I've been coming to 411 for over 10 years now and we are literally down to 2 good writers. The rest have become so pathetically caught up in this smart arse bullshit overlooking the bigger picture of what and who is great.
Posted By: Andrew Barbarash (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:57 PM
I should be used to it on this site by now, but the lack of interest in wrestling displayed by some of these so-called "wrestling fans" is one of the weirdest f##king things I've ever seen.
"I don't care if his matches are spectacular; I'd have to do more than lazily flip through the channels to see them! Besides, everyone knows that REALLY great wrestlers are defined not by their wrestling ability, but whether or not they can get Vince to like them!"
Posted By: Bruce L (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 02:14 AM
"... Look at Taker, he is wrestling's Rene Descartes. His character is a Cartesian circle: I can't lose much because it ruins the mystique. What is the mystique? That I don't lose much.
Posted By: Jon (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 12:32 PM"
THANK YOU. Finally, someone gets it.
Posted By: Harry Hazel (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 02:23 AM
"He is a top draw for two of WWE's most important markets: the ever-increasing Hispanic audience, who have someone who represents their culture in Rey, and children, who will always cheer for the underdog that flies around in a mask like Superman."
Superman doesn't wear a mask, Silly! What are you talking about?! : P
Posted By: Crook (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 02:53 AM
Goddamn, there's a lot of crybabies around here.
Posted By: Highscore Kid (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 12:28 AM
Its just a good thing that everyone is anonymous.. for now.. or you'd see 'troll killings' take the place of 'road rage'.
Posted By: Guest#0094 (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 03:08 AM
" Orton should be top 5. He was and is a real force from almost the moment he arrived in WWE, and is arguably the best heel of the past 10 years.
Posted By: Me (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 11:55 PM"
You have to admit, it'a taken him about 6 or 7 different pushes whereas most talent who aren't 'chosen' ones get one or two at best.
Posted By: Olympic Hero (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 04:58 AM
The comments here show why lists like this are useless. Mega stars like Rock and Austin are in the high 20's, but a no name like Desmond Wolfe cracks the top 20.
I enjoy these sites, but you "smart" fans are retards. Especially Hubbard. The top wrestlers of any decade should be the guys that were the most popular and made the most money. Because going based on skill or championships is useless. Rock was the best of the decade, even if he wasn't around that long. Number two is either Austin or Cena. Austin probaly gets the edge, but the fact is he had his biggest success in the late 90's. That's the only reason I could see somebody saying Cena.
Posted By: Guest#4312 (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 05:20 AM
chhhh everyone is entitled to their own opnion...orton is defs in my opinion in the top 10 though...
Posted By: Guest#9815 (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 05:27 AM
Goddamn, there's a lot of crybabies around here.
Posted By: Highscore Kid (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 12:28 AM
The Internet Wrestling Community: Where The Big Boys Get Butt Hurt
Posted By: son of pillman sr. (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 07:19 AM
Pretty damn good list. Someone else cracked the top 10, but I thought I'd list it in the order I think it should be.
10. Triple H
9. Undertaker
8. Samoa Joe
7. Edge
6. Chris Jericho
5. Bryan Danielson
4. John Cena
3. Shawn Michaels
2. AJ Styles
1. Kurt Angle
Posted By: Tim (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 09:33 AM
My God you people are stupid... Open your goddamn minds!!! Good list...
And to the comment saying:
"
I could tell you I put on 5 star matches every week in front of 100 neighborhood folk, but does it mean anything?
I could tell you I put on 5 star matches every week in front of 100 neighborhood folk, but does it mean anything?"
Yes it does! That is how Punk, Joe, McGuinness, and Danielson got signed! By having those amazing matches in front of a couple hundred people...
Posted By: Kyle (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 11:57 AM
I don't think you can have it both ways. If columns on this site such as this one want to focus on mainstream American product such as WWE & TNA then that's fine. I wont read it, but that's fine because then you will have some clear parameters. However, if you're going to acknowledge that there is wrestling outside of those two (and that it's often far superior) then I think it's a bit silly to pick and choose. You hate Lucha Libre? That's akin to a wrestling fan saying, 'I hate catcher's catch can', or 'I hate Memphis style', or 'I hate strong style'. If you like wrestling it's like enjoying ice cream. You get a multitude of flavors. Some you like much more than others, but you still like ice cream. And you may really dislike one flavor and would never order it, but it's still ice cream so you should respect it as such. In other words, saying Mistico doesn't make the cut because you don't like lucha renders this list meaningless. That would be like me writing the colum and saying I cant stand Triple H or Cena (and I can't) and then leaving two of the top stars of the decade off the list because of it.
Posted By: DocSarpolis (Guest)
your point is meaningless by suggesting we should respect a ice-cream flavor we despise because it's ice-cream. I don't watch the Japanese feds but I'm kinda interested now because of the detailed way he's laying this all out. C'mon man, it's the 411 crowd, if there were Luchas included everyone would be freaking there are too many "nobodies" on this list. It's his list, a writer writes what he knows & I think it's a pretty good list. He doesn't watch the Lucha wrestling so why should he comment on it? if he did, you would jump on him for "not knowing what he's talking about". So, I can't believe I'm typing this, Hubbard knows what he's writing about.
Keep complaining & he'll bring back that wreslemania odyssey thing. Then no one wins.
I hate mint-chocolate chip ice-cream & have never respected it. The thought I should respect it, makes me despise it even more, thanks Doc....
Posted By: BlueOyster (Guest) on December 26, 2009 at 07:54 PM
Haha, I'm with you. I used a poor analogy. Good points. I guess my main argument is that the more caveats and parameters you place on a list, the less meaningful the list. So, by simply disregarding 1 of the top 3 regions for wrestling (Mexico) you're sort of saying, 'Wrestler of the Decade (in the U.S. & Japan)'.
Perhaps a better analogy would be to compare it to film criticism. A respectable critic would view the most highly touted films from around the world regardless of whether or not he/she simply rarely cared for films from Mexico. I mean, what credibility would a list of the Top 10 Films of 2000 be if the person making the list hadn't even bothered to see 'Amores Perros'.
Posted By: DocSarpolis (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 12:23 PM
This list is a fucking shit in the face of wrestling. You think because some no-name motherfucking nobody from Ring of Meh is better than The Rock? It doesn't matter what you think you pretentious piece of fail, your lists like your crackhead momma suck a big ass dick. You have ruined wrestling with your faggy little opinion.
Posted By: The bassist from The Offspring (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 12:32 PM
Jesus. It's a list on a wrestling site. Is there any reason to get -mad- over it?
Posted By: DaveP (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 01:09 PM
GIVE US A F**KING LIST THAT ISN'T SMART related and that give us the TOP WRESTLERS OF THE DECADE the ones with the most impact and memorable moments.... not some japanese dudes who wrestled a ***** match in a bingo hall
you do realise that wrestling draws HUGE in japan and that the bigger promotions regularly do crowds of 8000
Posted By: guest 15265 (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 02:25 PM
After flipping through his choices, I think this will be Aaron's Top 5, barring any Japanese wrestler I don't know:
1. Undertaker
2. Cena
3. Triple H
4. HBK
5. Angle
I could flip 3 and 4 depending on if he puts more weight on athletic achievement or championships
Posted By: y2kev (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 04:24 PM
I predict Chris Jericho will be #1
Posted By: Joel (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 04:57 PM
List has been great.
You should have made a WWE only list, so all the butthurt fanboys could stop their crying...well on second thought, they would still probably find something to cry about.
Posted By: eh... (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 05:24 PM
the decade lasted 10 years!!! qhat the fuck was punk or hardy doing for the entire decade????? theyre both brought in and given shit tile runs. and desmond? what the fuck? all those "title" wins regular fans never saw. why all this shit? just print the big names and the ones who deserved it, not the ones you mark all cream over
Posted By: pjl32 (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 06:11 PM
eddies greatness was exaggerated, but battista and punk werent shoved down our throats?
Posted By: 65986[0-8 (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 06:16 PM
Who is eddie guerraro? No one knows most of these guyz. CENA will be number one! Boooooooshhhhh!
but seriously who is that eddie guy?
Posted By: cenarockz (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 06:23 PM
comment from chris 2698 nailed it. youre comparing industry standards (wwe) to indy shit roh that most people dont gret to see. what is the criteria? workrate? money produced? you should pick a criteira
Posted By: pjl (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 06:30 PM
and once again the WWE bias blasts through. You've got wrestlers who were chronologically in a promotion other that WWE first have WWE first, you've got wrestlers who spent longer in non-WWE promotions still have WWE first.....why do you have WWE first. As you said yourself, this is 411WRESTLING, not 411marketing or 411WWE.
Posted By: Vince McWoman (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 06:54 PM
DANNY BASHAM # 1
Posted By: The Narcissist (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 07:46 PM
and once again the WWE bias blasts through. You've got wrestlers who were chronologically in a promotion other that WWE first have WWE first, you've got wrestlers who spent longer in non-WWE promotions still have WWE first.....why do you have WWE first. As you said yourself, this is 411WRESTLING, not 411marketing or 411WWE.
Posted By: Vince McWoman (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 06:54 PM
Cause the WWE Is the Number 1 company in the world deal with it
Posted By: FACTS (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 10:25 PM
I predict Chris Jericho will be #1
Posted By: Joel (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 04:57 PM
No because that would mean that this list would have the top person based on skill, talent, and fact rather than opinion and fluff.
Posted By: Gullo (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 11:32 PM
First of all, some of IWC should not take the list as seriously you are with your comments.
Second, lets get it out in the open, WWE is the number one company. With that statement said, it is not the only wrestling promotion out there nor deserve a god-like status.
As for the list, I personally respect the list because of what the wrestlers have done in their careers that helped their promotions to draw money and fans.(Keywords: THEIR PROMOTIONS.)Meaning the company the wrestlers work for, whether it is WWE,TNA, or "god-forbid, the biggest indy scum of the whole universe"(really it is not that bad of a promotion) ROH.
The criteria of the list is very straight-forward, which is pretty confusing with people complaining about it. In the end, everyone is entitled with their own opinions, but for god sake people use some amount of logic, please.
Posted By: spider19 (Guest) on December 28, 2009 at 02:14 AM
Cause the WWE Is the Number 1 company in the world deal with it
Posted By: FACTS (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 10:25 PM
----------------------------------
You said it yourself, they're a big pool of number one.
Posted By: Vince McWoman (Guest) on December 28, 2009 at 06:04 AM
Pretty good list I gotta see how the top ten shapes up. As for the argument for Orton, he was injury prone....only reason he was the youngest Champ was to get Brock Lesnar off their history books. Look at how he was booked as champ when he won it. He didn't come into his own as a top heel til the last few years of the decade, if he didn't catch on like he did he might not have beaten out Hardy or Batista given the way this guy set his criteria.
Good article and to be upset bout him not expanding his wrestling feds being seen. No disrespect but, if you look at it sporting/business wise versus simple entertainment, the WWE(and will say TNA) is considered the major leagues, hate to say it like that but it is. If the other indy feds were on the level of WWE then this list would be a lot harder to do. All the other independents work to get on that national level. There might be a lot of indy workers that are better but, evidently they haven't been called up to supposed "Big League" it sucks but you gotta deal with it. This isn't the territories of old either where a wrestler can find a way to travel the circuit and build up their name its a lil harder to break that ceiling and if you can't make WWE or TNA(and ROH since they are broadcasting) then you might not get recognized. Only reason Japan is recognized is like a previous poster said, a hell of a lot of the "signature" moves you all enjoy have been done in Japan for years if not Decades...and they respect wrestling a hell of a lot more than damn near anyone.
Posted By: Guest#3853 (Guest) on December 28, 2009 at 10:41 AM
Cause the WWE Is the Number 1 company in the world deal with it
Posted By: FACTS (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 10:25 PM
----------------------------------
You said it yourself, they're a big pool of number one.
Posted By: Vince McWoman (Guest) on December 28, 2009 at 06:04 AM
ya anf TNA is A big Ol Number 2
Posted By: Guest#8670 (Guest) on December 28, 2009 at 10:24 PM
Cause the WWE Is the Number 1 company in the world deal with it
Posted By: FACTS (Guest) on December 27, 2009 at 10:25 PM
----------------------------------
You said it yourself, they're a big pool of number one.
Posted By: Vince McWoman (Guest) on December 28, 2009 at 06:04 AM
ya anf TNA is A big Ol Number 2
Sure is, they are both a heap of crap.
WWE and TNA marks are funny.
Posted By: Vince McWoman (Guest) on December 29, 2009 at 05:42 AM
Copyright � 2011 411mania.com, LLC. All rights reserved.
Click here for our privacy policy. Please help us serve you better, fill out our survey.
Use of this site signifies your agreement to our terms of use.