Ask 411 Wrestling 04.02.14: WrestleMania Plans, Austin vs. Hogan, More
Posted by Mathew Sforcina on 04.02.2014
Why didn't Steve Austin face Hulk Hogan at WrestleMania 18? Why was Sunny the first Diva in the WWE Hall of Fame? All this and more covered this week in Ask 411 Wrestling!
Welcome to the only column written by a guy who is now available in Pinata Form, Ask 411 Wrestling! I am your host and possible Pinata target, Mathew Sforcina, and this is Wrestlemania Week!
*blows party favour*
Anyway, this week is focused on Wrestlemania and the HOF, and while it's not a Total Opinion Week, I'm going to combine the sections simply because looking down the list, I'll need to rely on opinion for a bunch of them. Just so we're clear.
Oh, and if I get anything wrong, since I've started writing this on April 1st… I'm just getting it wrong.
Legality of Streaming: First, second and third of all: I'm not a trained lawyer, and every country is different. However, my read of the situation with streaming is that the onus is on the one providing the stream to be legal. When you upload a video to youtube, it does ask you if you're the copyright holder, and often sites will have disclaimers that say that it's on the uploader to ensure it's legit. So using that logic, if you watch WM at a bar, you can argue that it is up to the guy showing it to make sure he's legit. Unless the bar is saying "Come in and watch an illegal stream of WM!" then you should be able to claim good faith in the highly unlikely event you're called up on it. Possibly you could try that argument on an internet stream but good faith is a LOT harder to claim there.
Morality of streaming is a totally different question. But yeah, the law says you can't deal in illegal or illegally obtained goods or services, and that includes streaming PPVs.
The Trivia Crown
I've had crowns on my head for while, but not many people liked it. Sadly, one of my wrestling trainers passed away not long ago. I've had experience in movies and TV series and I certainly have no love lost for turkeys. In the wrestling promotion where I've had my biggest success, I've won all the major singles titles and biggest one-night tournaments, except for one. Few people may know this, but I was born in a sector of a very important city. That sector's name, if it was written in Spanish and translated to English, will remember MANY fans of a wrestler I had my most satisfactory win against. Who am I?
Matt Boogie has the answer (and even in my preferred format, well done!).
-2010 King of the Ring
-One of my trainers passed away not long ago: Mark Starr (2013)
-Had experience in movies (The Escapist) and TV (Dustin's Daily News)
-No love for turkeys (Dustin the Turkey on Dustin's Daily News)
-All major singles titles in WWE, except Intercontinental; 2010 King of the Ring
-Born in Cabra, Dublin, Ireland. Cabra translates to "goat." Most satisfying win the 18 second win over Daniel Bryan.
You are SHEAMUS!
I got this week's question.
What am I? I'm a Wrestlemania with two gimmick matches. Multiple matches featured managers, although no-one with a manager managed to win their match. No tag titles were defended, although the guys who held the belts did wrestle. I had a women's match, the Streak was on the line, two titles changed hands, and at least one WCW Champion watched the show. Oh, and I was cross marketed with something horrible. What am I?
Getting Down To Business/One Man's (Important) Opinion
For the record I'll be using non-Roman numerals throughout this column just for consistency/my own sanity. Although I'll still call it 2000 rather than 16 because that's burnt into my skull by now.
Taha proves my point about mixing these headings.
I'm sending you this email all the way from Sydney. #represent. Thanks for answering my previous questions. I'm feeling quite festive and I have a few random WrestleMania inspired questions for you to answer.
1. For WM main events only, how many faces have been pinned (or submit) cleanly and which is the most jaw-dropping one? By that I mean something you didn't expect to happen.
See, what constitutes a main event here? The final match? Just the title matches? What Wikipedia decides? People will often ask about ‘main events' without bothering to clarify what they consider a main event.
Anyway, using Wikipedia's list, there are four, and a few sortas.
Wrestlemania 6, 12, 23, 26, 28 and 29 are all sortas since nominally both participants in the match are faces, so a face was pinned/tapped clean.
But the question seems to imply being pinned or submitting to a heel, and in that case its 9, Yoko over Bret (if you count that as the main), 2000 where Hunter beat everyone, 17 where Austin sold his soul, and 27 where Miz retained over Cena thanks to the Rock.
And even including the sortas, although Austin's heel turn was somewhat unexpected, at few called 27, 2000 is still the winner. That was so out of left field to go against tradition and have the bad guy truly win, and in such a match too. Foley or Rock was the assumed course, no-one expected Hunter to walk out still with the belt. Everything after that had 2000 to come before it, 2000 was the one that broke the mold.
2. WM is partially used for happy endings to feuds/angles. However there have been heel turns at the event. Again, what is the most jaw-dropping heel turn to occur at WM?
Trish turning heel at 20 made my jaw drop, although not so much in shock but more over the transformation that occurred right before my eyes.
Rick Martel - walked out on Tito Santana during Strike Force match at WM 5
Curt Hennig - heelishly disqualified Lex Luger as guest referee at WM 10
Bret Hart - famed "double-turn" Sharpshooter finish vs. Steve Austin at WM 13
Triple H - reunited with Chyna and turned on X Pac at WM 15
Vince McMahon - turned on The Rock in the main event of WM 16
Steve Austin - aligned with Vince McMahon to defeat The Rock at WM 17
Trish Stratus - swerved Chris Jericho to reveal her loyalty to Christian at WM 20
And then whatever the hell Chyna did at 15.
But in this case, Austin at 17. Always Austin at 17. Outside of Hogan being the third man and the mythical, never going to happen Cena Turn, that's still the biggest heel turn in history. And one of the most costly, but hey…
3. At WM25 the Hardy boys faced off in what I thought was an awesome match. That match was a result of Matt attacking Jeff during his World title match against Edge because a rumour was leaked that Christian was planned to attack Jeff. My question is had Christian helped his buddy Edge what was the plan leading up to that WrestleMania for both the Hardys and Edge and Christian?
Basically the four were going to be intertwined, they were all going to be involved in the same storyline. As for specifics, the idea I think was most likely was The Hardyz V Edge and Christian, but I've heard Jeff V Christian and HHH V Edge as co-mains, or all four in a ladder match for the belt, but the four would be against each other in some form or another.
But since the swerve was so early on in terms of WM, long term plans weren't set in stone, obviously since they got changed. But yeah, Hardys/E&C seems the most logical and best outcome there.
4. In some of his biggest matches at the event The Rock has applied the sharpshooter to his opponent in which he clearly hooks both legs. Is that variation of the sharpshooter at all effective?
In Kayfabe? Sure, it's as good as any other move. What he's losing in pressure on the knee he's gaining on the back by forcing his opponent to bend more and put his weight onto bending point.
In slightly more analytical kayfabe? Not really, he's rarely gotten wins with it, with his biggest being a Montreal win.
In superficial shoot viewing? No, it looks horrible.
In actuality? It's over, so it is effective. Even if it still looks horrible.
Since the deep stat question I was gonna do here I can't since running times for some Wrestlemanias isn't available to me just yet (if you happen to have running times, do send them in please), let's move onto Thomas and his HOF question.
Can you explain how Sunny was inducted into the Hall of Fame before Trish, Lita or even Sable. I for one was a huge Sunny mark back in the day but can't understand how she was inducted when you look at the fact she never wrestled and only had a short stint in the then WWF. She never even managed a singles champion and never had much of career before and after her time working for Vince and Co. Not to mention her inability to stay off the dirt sheets. So what was the idea to put her in as the original diva and not use her in some other capacity afterwards. They must of had some plan for her, but then again she was never brought back before then so what gives. I'm asking this question as if her rehab stint, six arrests in a month and her negative comments about the WWE rehab program never happened.
They put her in because she was in the good books with WWE at that point and she WAS the original diva, or at least was the prototype for every woman WWE has wanted women to be after her, good looking, talented, good looking, good talker, good looking, good looking and hey if they can wrestle, awesome.
Oh, and good looking.
So without her, there is no Trish, Lita, Sable etc, since she was the first major female name in the WWE to be a ‘Diva' as opposed to a female wrestler. In retrospect, sure, she's fallen off the wagon a bit. But at the time she was looking good in terms of outlook, and as a female and as someone alive, she got put in.
Again, the WWE HOF isn't a scientific standard here. It's very dependent on the moods of the bosses, the story they want to tell, and who they like at any given point. Order of entry means nothing.
Tom is the first guy to have a WM themed question plucked from a longer list.
Who was the first male wrestler born after the date of the first Wrestlemania, March 31, 1985, to compete in a Wrestlemania match?Bit of a pointless question, but I've always wanted to know for some reason.
Well, if we assume someone has to be 18 to wrestle at WM, then we can start at WM18 and go from there. I'm using the very scientific method of just looking over the rosters and seeing who's ‘young'. And dark matches don't count because reasons.
… Good lord, Orton's only 34.
Chris Masters is close in 84… Felt sure one of the ECW New Breed would be, but nope…
Cody Rhodes. Born June 30, 1985, wrestled second match, Wrestlemania 26.
All right, let me see for dark matches…
Well, DH Smith worked the WM26 Battle Royal, and he was born August 2, 1985. As did Trent Barreta, born March 30, 1987. Zack Ryder was runner up there, and he was born May 14, 1985.
Going back a year to WM25, Ryder and Curt Hawkins, who was born April 20, 1985, were lumberjacks so that doesn't count…
WM24 did have a battle royal, and Cody worked that one.
WM23 was a lumberjack match, WM22 had no-one, WM21 had no-one, WM20 had no dark match, and the previous two were tags with no-one. So the answer actually is Cody Rhodes, regardless of how you judge it.
Nightwolf has a couple of questions.
1. I read somewhere that the original plan was for Undertaker to go from the Biker Gimmick back to his Dead man Gimmick and fight Brock Lesnar at Wrestlemaina 20. I heard Brock Lesnar didn't want to fight Undertaker and that was one of the reasons why he left. Is there any truth to that?
… That's the first I've ever heard of it.
*google-fus for a bit*
OK, the plan was for Brock and Taker to feud after Wrestlemania, in that after Brock lost the belt to Eddie, he'd beat Goldberg at WM, then move into a feud with Undertaker (and probably put him over to repay Taker putting him over earlier) while Eddie would be the other main star/focus as he defended the WWE Title against JBL. Brock wasn't happy about a bunch of things (not getting to defend the belt at WM, Goldberg's contract, having to put over Taker) and left, but had he stayed, JBL probably wouldn't have ended up with the belt so… Yeah.
2. Do you feel that the CM Punk walkout is a work? Like say CM Punk leaves after Royal Rumble. The WWE takes shot at him week after week. Daniel Byran beats Triple H and gets put in the main event at Wrestlemania like CM Punk wanted. Daniel Bryan finally wins at Wrestlemania 30. The next night on Raw a furious Randy Orton demands a rematch calling Daniel Byran's win a fluke. Triple H makes the match for Extreme Rules which happens to be in Aberdeen, Washington. Then for weeks leading to Extreme Rules Triple H makes Bryan's life Hell Ala Vince/Stone Cold. Daniel Bryan retains against Randy Orton at Extreme Rules. The next several months features Daniel Bryan defying the odds and retaining, but getting beat down by the Authority. Finally at the Background pay-per-view, Daniel Bryan is getting assaulted and CM Punk's music hits and he says Daniel Bryan thus leading to the Summer of Punk angle. I know it might not happen, but hey one can only hope.
It's a shoot that eventually might become a work. I don't think Punk leaving is anything other than Punk getting fed up and telling WWE where to go and what to do when they get there. He's sitting at home waiting for his contract to expire and having some time off and he probably doesn't intend to return, or at least didn't when he left.
But, it's possible that Vince did in fact get to him and they've then turned this into a work, and he may come back at WM in a combined 8/20 ending where he helps Bryan fend off the Authority and Bryan wins and they hug, or possibly even coming back the next night on Raw as New & Improved Corporate Scumback Phil Brooks or what have you. But he's not back by then, then his return, if it happens, is almost certainly not a work. The Chicago Raw would have been the most logical, WM the biggest, the Raw after WM the last point they'd do it if he was already back. Anything after that is them coming to terms at that point, no earlier.
But honestly, I don't think he'll return. Not unless every main eventer not called Bryan comes down with Lottery Winitis or something.
So, in honor of WM, after the WM remix Part 2…
Here's a few of my fav 3 promo videos from past WMs. Sure, you've seen these lots of times, but dammit, watch them again. And my fav title change ever.
Heh, Christian beat a woman…
Rich asks about announcements.
First time asker, long time reader etc
My questions is for the Wrestlemania week you're doing and it's about the very first one.
How was Wrestlemania first announced? How did we get from War to Settle The Score to Wrestlemania, and how Did they establish that Wrestlemania was going to be the "one" was it Mr T involvement? I have looked on YouTube and can't find anything in way of a first announcement.
Basically in the WWF syndicated shows following War to Settle the Etc they showed videos of Hulk and Mr. T training and Piper and Orndorff training, as well as showing Piper's Pits and interviews with various people talking about their matches at WM. They kinda just announced that due to Orndorff and T interfering in the War match, a tag match between the two was signed for WM. They didn't need 30 minute promos about faces of the company back then, they just had guys who didn't like each other, and a place to sort out the differences.
But yeah, I couldn't find a first announcement either.
Todd asks a sort of WM question. It starts and ends there…
Watching and enjoying the WWE network, saw the match from Mania IV where Savage won the title. He would defend and lose the title at the next years show against Hogan. I know in between there was a lot of tag matches with the Mega Powers vs. various team. Did Savage ever defend the title on TV during that year between 'manias? I'm sure he did at house shows, but I do not remember him having a real feud for the title other than maybe a rematch with Dibiase. Did he?
… I did this, didn't I?
*checks old columns*
… I did. And from the same guy probably! Still, for any new readers, Savage defended against One Man Gang, Ted Dibiase, Virgil, Conquistador #1, Andre The Giant, Dino Bravo, Bad News Brown, Akeem, Red Rooster, King Haku, Raymond Rougeau, Big Bossman, Rick Rude, and The Ultimate Warrior between the WMs.
I don't normally include such padding, but this is the WM column, and WM always has useless padding, so here we are. Moving onto Pete with a couple of lang standing WM questions.
The story goes that Mr Perfect was to beat Hulk for the title in late 1989/early 1990. Then the Warrior was to beat him at Wrestlemania 6. What was the plan for Hulk at Wrestlemania if that story is correct?
That's one story, but there were MANY floating about around that time, Hogan/Zeus, Hogan/Perfect, Perfect/Warrior, Hogan/Heel Warrior, Hogan/Beefcake, Hogan-Liz/Savage-Sherri…
See, the thing was that they knew that Hogan was going to leave for a bit to go try movies, and they had to have the title around for house shows and the like. They decided that Warrior was the one to get it, and this was back when Warrior hadn't won the IC title, he won that to get him over enough.
But the thing was, they didn't know how they'd get from Hogan to Warrior, and Perfect was seen as a good enough choice as transitional, but then Hogan/Perfect didn't draw well, and then Patterson famously went "Why don't they just fight?".
But if Perfect/Hogan did draw well enough to have Perfect be the switcher, Hogan probably wouldn't be on the card at all, selling the shotgun blast that Perfect would have to use to get the win or whatever. Failing that, Zeus or Savage again? Again, it never got to the point where Perfect/Warrior was in the cards enough to have a solid Hogan match plan.
And what was the plan for Randy Savage at Wrestlemania 4 and beyond if Tee Dibiase was slated to win the tournament?
Savage would have been screwed out of the tourney win during WMIV, feud with Ted during the year, and then destroy Ted at Summerslam to win title. And then probably go straight into heel turn and drop the belt to Hogan mode.
frankiemon asks a question about something from the past…
Lastly a small request, in honour of Wrestlemania 30, is there any chance of you reviving Super Wrestlemania in any form, maybe over Twitter for votes? I, for one, really enjoyed it back in the day.
Cheers as always thanks for your insight and intelligence
… Well obviously not now.
For anyone late to the party, back in 09 I did an ‘Ultimate Wrestlemania' where over several weeks the readers voted on participants and created the Ultimate Wrestlemania card. You can see it here.
Obviously it's a bit late for this year, but maybe… The Ultimate Summerslam? Would that be an idea worth doing? Let me know below, and maybe we can do that this year…
… I forget who booked the Kane/Rose match. Probably me, it certainly fits my style of comedy.
JJ has some more HOF questions.
Thanks as always for answering our questions - the column is a must-read every Wednesday.
Who do you think inducts the Undertaker when he finally gets into the HOF? Kane? Shawn Michaels? Vince himself?
Assuming that when Taker gets in he actually speaks, whoever will intro him has to be someone with serious history with him. Shawn would probably be the choice WWE would want, Foley I suspect would be a good compromise, but honestly, it has to Kane. The two are so intertwined now, anyone else who isn't Paul Bearer doing it just doesn't seem right. Kane and Taker are half brothers after all, and they've teamed and fought for so long…
If Paul Bearer hadn't passed away, any idea what the booking would have been for Undertaker/Punk?
Considering the fact that WWE knew for months they were heading towards that match (albeit flirting with the idea of it being for the belt) and then had Punk winning a four way match on a random Raw to ‘earn' the right to fight Taker, I doubt WWE had any idea. Probably it would have centred around Punk no selling the mind games and how he was a new kind of wrestler and above old men with light shows and stuff. It would have been predictable and boring but effective enough to make the match not suck too much.
I know you are very busy with all of your writing endeavors, but when Kane finally hangs it up, will you write the his final Evolution Schematic?
Thanks as always!
… Not a WM question, but screw it.
Assuming I'm still around, probably. I got like a third in to totally rewriting it as Kane, Super Genius before I gave up and kept it as is, so given Corporate Kane I'll almost certainly go that way the final time, so yeah, there will be a Version 3.0, once Kane retires or if I retire in more than 2-3 years.
Joant asks about the mother of all missed opportunities.
Long-time lurker and fan (you've heard this a million times), although once or twice I've written opinions in the comments section of other 411 mania columns. I really appreciate the thought and work you put into this column. I love 411mania Wrestling, as it keeps me informed and up-to-date. I am a 34 y/o psychiatrist married to a lawyer, so you can imagine that most of my friends are not wrestling fans and take it as an oddity that I am (although my wife is very supportive of it; she bought us tickets to see Hell in a Cell 2013 here in Miami where we live, and accompanied me even though she does not like wrestling). And Hell in a Cell 2013? The text-book definition of wrong outcome, and the audience there for the most part was completely deflated...NOT angry, actively booing the heel, as that would actually still be a reaction, but DEFLATED. But that is a whole other topic, and I have digressed enough.
So on to my question. Wrestlemania X-8, Hogan vs Rock. Epic, significant battle, clash of generations, etc, etc. And the match itself turned out great, better than anyone would have thought, by the way. But really, I would dare say that what most people really really wanted to see was Hogan vs Austin, because those 2 were truly THE TOP GUY of their generation. I always heard that Hogan-Austin was the original idea, but that Austin refused to work with Hogan due to some thing or another when they were both in WCW in the early 90s. Yet not long ago I read somewhere that during an interview Austin said that at Wrestlemania X-8 it should have been Austin vs Hogan, that THAT was the marquee match. If it is true that Austin said this, then the other theory can't be true. So which is it? Why did Austin vs Hogan not happen? (by the way, I don't think Austin vs Hogan would've had as good a match as Rock vs Hogan, but again I digress and that would be another whole other topic).
Thank you. And don't worry, I know you receive lots and lots of questions, so I can wait the whole year of 2014 for my answer. I read your column every week anyway.
Let's go to Austin's comments from the first ever Jim Ross Podcast.
The full recap…
Austin was also asked if he had any regrets for never working a major program with Hulk Hogan. The two did square off for a minute during a tag team match on RAW right before WrestleMania 18, which you can watch above. Austin said that at the time he was running real hard and was "hard headed as hell," and that he wasn't about to do a job for Hogan because the word then was that Hogan wasn't willing to do the favors for anyone. Austin said that while Hogan was open to having a match, he wasn't because he felt that their styles would clash and that the match wouldn't live up to his standards. At that time, Austin could go and he felt that Hogan would have been a step or two behind him, which wasn't acceptable to him. He won't do a high profile match just for a payoff. He said that if he wasn't as hard headed at the time, then a program should have happened, and he has the utmost respect for Hogan and everything he's done.
Austin brought up Hogan's match with The Rock at WrestleMania 18, and noted how they had the crowd in their palm of their hands. He said that it was one of the most electric crowds that he had ever seen, and that it was an unbelievable matchup, even though they didn't have to do much. He said that everything they did in that match meant so much and got an unbelievable response, and he took his hat off to both men for the match they put on.
Now, of course, that's just what Austin says now, so you may have to take some salt, but probably not a lot since Austin's not known as a bullshitter. So yeah, it's a case of Austin at the time being standoffish, and if Hogan didn't want to job (which is the default status with Hogan for the most part), and Austin didn't want to job, and Austin's also not going to swallow his pride and have a match just for money, they couldn't make it work out. With stars that big, if they don't want to do it, they don't want to do it. Sure, you could force it, but one or both might walk out or dog the match or work snug or anything could go wrong.
In retrospect, I'm sure Austin would want to do the match, but at the time he didn't want the match for the sake of having the match, if that makes sense. Hindsight is a hell of a thing, and Austin was very hard headed around that time, whereas today he's much more level headed.
… Oh good, counting questions, since I couldn't do the other ones. Charlene may well end us off…
b) Who has been in the most consecutive World Title matches at WrestleMania? Has to be Cena or HHH right?
Assuming you're not including the ECW title belt, each show, in order (both yearly and on the show proper)
WM2: Hogan (C) V Bundy
WM3: Hogan (C) V Andre
WM4: Savage V DiBiase
WM5: Savage (C) V Hogan
WM6: Hogan (C) V Warrior
WM7: Slaughter (C) V Hogan
WM8: Flair (C) V Savage
WM9: Bret (C) V Yoko, Yoko (C) V Hogan
WM10: Yoko (C) V Lex, Yoko (C) V Bret
WM11: Diesel (C) V Michaels
WM12: Bret (C) V Michaels
WM13: Sid (C) V Taker
WM14: Michaels (C) V Austin
WM15: Rock (C) V Austin
WM2000: HHH (C) V Rock V Big Show V Foley
WM17: Rock (C) V Austin
WM18: Jericho (C) V HHH
WM19: HHH (C) V Booker, Angle (C) V Lesnar
WM20: Eddie (C) V Angle, HHH (C) V Michaels V Benoit
WM21: JBL (C) V Cena, HHH (C) V Batista
WM22: Angle (C) V Orton V Mysterio, Cena (C) V HHH
WM23: Batista (C) V Taker, Cena (C) V Michaels
WM24: Orton (C) V HHH V Cena, Edge (C) V Taker
WM25: Edge (C) V Cena V Big Show, HHH (C) V Orton
WM26: Jericho (C) V Edge, Batista (C) V Cena
WM27: Edge (C) V Del Rio, Miz (C) V Cena
WM28: Bryan (C) V Sheamus, Punk (C) V Jericho
WM29: Del Rio (C) V Swagger, Rock (C) V Cena
Well, there's two ways to answer this.
If you count EVERY title match separately, then the winner is Yokozuna with 4. 9 and 10, he had two world title matches each show, in a row. Everyone else keeps having the other title in the way.
If you just mean "one match per year", then HHH has 5 (18-22), but Cena has 7 (21-27) for the win.
c) Outside of the Undertaker, who has had the most WrestleMania wins in a row?
Rob Van Dam and Miz are both at 4-0, although both men have had losses on pre-shows, Miz at the WM25 dark match to unify the tag titles, and Rob in a tag match at 19, losing to Storm and Morley.
If you don't count them, then it's Road Warrior Animal with 3-0.
d) Who has been in the most World Title matches at WrestleMania? I asked consecutive earlier, but all together, incuding both World Titles (but uh, maybe not the ECW one....) who has been in the most World Title matches? Would you be able to order who has been in the most to least like Wikipedia does?
… Yeah, all right. Up to 29…
8 John Cena, Triple H
6 Hulk Hogan
5 Shawn Michaels
4 Edge, The Rock, Yokozuna
3 Batista, Bret Hart, Chris Jericho, Kurt Angle, Randy Orton, Randy Savage, Steve Austin, The Undertaker
2 Alberto Del Rio, The Big Show
1 Andre The Giant, Booker T, Brock Lesnar, Chris Benoit, CM Punk, Daniel Bryan, Diesel, Eddie Guerrero, Jack Swagger, JBL, King Kong Bundy, Lex Luger, Mick Foley, Rey Mysterio, Ric Flair, Sgt Slaughter, Sheamus, Sid, Ted DiBiase, The Miz, The Ultimate Warrior
e) How many people have participated in World Title matches at WM? We've had 29 shows but there's clearly repetition of people.
And on that informative, but slightly dull ending, I bid you all goodbye from this WM edition of Ask 411 Wrestling. We'll return to regular transmission next week. So until then, dear readers…