411’s Buy or Sell 4.07.07: FIP in ROH, The Independent Boom, NWA Title Status and More
Posted by Larry Csonka on 04.07.2007
The debut edition of BUY or SELL looks at FIP title defenses in ROH, the Briscoe’s reign as Tag Champs, WSX talents getting developmental deals and more!
Welcome one and all to a new column here at 411 called BUY or SELL. BUY or SELL is very similar in nature to Fact or Fiction, as a matter of fact you could consider it Fact or Fiction's little brother. The main difference is that BUY or SELL will focus on the US Independent scene, Lucha Libre, Japanese Wrestling and basically anything that isn't mainstream wrestling, WWE and or TNA. This allows for these areas to get some more attention and for you, the reader, to learn even more about the sport of wrestling.
Week One's Match-Up:
Independent Video and DVD Reviewer John Gregory vs. The Independent Mid-Card's Samuel Berman!
Increased FIP World Heavyweight Title defenses in ROH are a good thing for Full Impact Pro.
John Gregory: SELL. My problem with the whole scenario is that FIP comes off as an ROH minor league rather than anything truly important. FIP has a much different identity than ROH, basically replacing the smarkier aspects of Ring of Honor with a more old school, Florida Championship Wrestling feel. Rosters are different, alignments are different, and the style is different. Having FIP title defenses in ROH just exposes this gap more than expand the prestige of the belt. I'd rather just see Roderick wearing the title than having defenses of it since the storylines are so much different. I've heard the rationale behind this is that the FIP Title is replacing the Pure Title as the second-tier championship on ROH shows. I still think ROH needs a second-tier title, but making it the FIP title hurts that company.
Samuel Berman: SELL. I agree with John on this one. While I'm fine with periodic FIP Title defenses outside of Florida, Roderick Strong has already put the belt on the line a number of times in Ring of Honor since winning it last fall. Also, seeing as the FIP Title has only changed hands twice in its history and one of those changes was on a Ring of Honor show, it would seem to telegraph the result of any of Strong's defenses in ROH. If he were have, say, lost the strap to Austin Aries in Detroit last weekend, which would mean that more of the FIP Heavyweight Title changes would have taken place outside of the company than had taken place on an actual FIP show. For the record, I think that the bigger threat to FIP's autonomy is the growing similarity in the ROH and FIP rosters.
1 for 1.
While WWE or TNA are not at their peak, ala the Attitude Era, Independent wrestling is the biggest it has ever been.
John Gregory: BUY. Man, most veteran wrestlers or old school fans would crucify me for saying that. The reason why is that independent wrestlers can make a living on the Indy scene. With ROH providing better paying, steady work in the U.S. and the opportunity for Japan and Europe trips, opportunities exist now that were not present in the 90s. A lot of this owes itself to ROH's great success in the past 5 years and it's rise from another Philly Indy promotion to an international powerhouse that sets the standard for great wrestling in our time. And with many notable Indies around the country like IWA Mid-South, PWG, Chikara, FIP and CZW getting attention from the greater wrestling community, I only see things improving.
Samuel Berman: BUY. But this is a conditional purchase. I think it has to be noted that ECW was the original super-Indy, and that as far as ROH has come, it isn't yet on the level of what ECW was able to become. None of the current crop of U.S. Independents has a weekly primetime television show on a major cable channel and none has as wide-reaching a touring schedule as ECW had in its heyday. However, with the myriad of promotions that John mentioned as well as OVW and Deep South providing a look at some of the developing superstars in the WWE pipeline, we're seeing an unprecedented chance for Independent talent to impress in a variety of markets. The main reason for this, by the way, is probably the increase in wrestling commentary and information on the Internet, which has allowed for the near-instantaneous release of results and news for companies that simply wouldn't have gotten on anyone's radar a decade ago. This morning, I ordered seven PWG shows in something like six mouse clicks. Buying ECW tapes in the mid-90s was like an endurance trial. Ask anyone.
2 for 2.
Low Ki vs. Samoa Joe in PWG this weekend will live up to their 2002 ROH encounter.
John Gregory: BUY. Since 2002, both guys have had lots of new experience and have improved as performers. Joe is now poised to become the face of TNA and make himself a big star for years to come. Ki, however, has completely recovered from his sloppy heel run in ROH and has been delivering one great match after another in IWA Mid-South (check out his two against Necro, his 4 TPI 06 matches, and his awesome match against Drake Younger). Both guys are at the top of their games, and they haven't had a high profile match up since their Glory by Honor match. These guys shouldn't disappoint after all the buildup a rematch has been given and should tear the house down in Southern California.
Samuel Berman: BUY. Like John said, Joe and Ki have both developed and improved over the last four-and-a-half years, meaning that there are a lot of new tricks and styles that they'll theoretically be able to integrate into this weekend's battle. That being said, I think a part of what made their ROH match special was the unique near-shoot atmosphere they created. Because of Joe's transition away from pure strong style, this will probably not be the ‘fight' we saw in ROH, but more of a wrestling match. So I'm buying that they're going to live up to the hype, but I'd sell the notion that this weekend's match will look anything like their ROH bout.
3 for 3.
Jay & Mark Briscoe will make it to Death Before Dishonor V as ROH World Tag Team Champions.
Samuel Berman: BUY. I don't think hotshotting the titles in Liverpool and Detroit was as bad an idea as some people are making it out to be. I like that Gabe's booking doesn't let me know what to expect. There's a difference between being unpredictable and being scattered, and Gabe Sapolsky is clearly the former. Anyway, with the title change having now occurred and with no other established dominant teams in ROH's tag team division, I think the Briscoe's have a very realistic shot at holding the belts until Death Before Dishonor V (which looks like it might be the weekend of June 22nd and 23rd in Dayton and Chicago). The Briscoe's don't have a title defense scheduled for next weekend's shows in Long Island and Edison and their scheduled defenses at the end of April are against newcomers (the CHIKARA guys who debut in St. Paul), students (Mitch Franklin & Pelle Primeau) or outsiders (Motor City Machine Guns of Alex Shelley & Chris Sabin in Chicago Ridge). With only two shows scheduled in May and two more in June before what I'm assuming will be the DBDV weekend, I'd say Jay & Mark have a good shot at keeping the belts until then.
John Gregory: BUY. And they could make it much longer than that as well. Some ROHbots were not happy about the "hotshotting" of the titles recently, but if you've read my IWA Mid-South reviews you'll see I have no patience for a lot of the ROH message board crowd, who think every title reign should be at least a year and matches should be a minimum of 40 minutes. Please. Gabe threw everyone a curveball by having the Briscoe's lose the belts and then fought each other once again. The theme of the first few months of 2007 has been surprise and ROH has been very exciting because of that. While the big question is when Morishima will lose the ROH Title, the Tag Titles could stay around the waists of the Briscoe's for much of this year, including maybe defending them in NOAH.
4 for 4!
Now that WSX contracts are void, Colt Cabana will not be the only ex-WSX wrestler to sign a developmental deal by Summerslam.
Samuel Berman: BUY. My answer is short here, because there aren't a lot of former WSX guys that I think fit the WWE mold. However, there is ALWAYS the chance that Sean Waltman could get brought back in, and Teddy Hart is a natural option if Vince decides to green light the ‘New Hart Foundation' idea that supposedly keeps getting bopped around. So I'm buying this one because I think at least one of those will happen. I'd caution anyone who thinks Jack Evans is all of a sudden going to show up on SmackDown! to keep dreaming.
John Gregory: SELL. Though I do think Teddy will end up there, just not that quickly. Most of the roster in WSX is made up of guys that would fit far better in TNA than WWE, and I would expect Matt Sydal, Jack Evans, and maybe Joey Ryan to be picked up by them if TNA wants to freshen their X-Division roster. Otherwise, there's guys in WSX who are not ready for the big time(Josh Abercrombie, Tyler Black) , wouldn't fit TNA or WWE's style(Jimmy Jacobs, Human Tornado, Arik Cannon), or are just past their prime (basically anyone who was in XPW).
4 for 5.
The NWA territories will be able to retain the NWA Title's world status once it is separated from TNA.
Samuel Berman: SELL. The whole ‘which titles have WORLD status' question is a purely subjective one, but once the NWA pulls its title from TNA, it will quickly become regarded similarly to the titles in CZW and PWG. I'm not saying that like it's a bad thing, just a realistic thing. Has Chris Hero ever been a World Champion? Well, he's held the CZW Title, but most people would tell you ‘no'. Meanwhile, Austin Aries, who has held the almost-universally recognized ROH World Title has been a World Champion. Again, it's all subjective. I suppose if "American Dragon" Bryan Danielson ends up being the next NWA World Heavyweight Champion as is rumored, it would go a long way towards keeping the newly de-Russo-fied title higher on the depth chart, as he's pretty much the elder statesman of the U.S. Independent scene at this point. In the end, whatever belt TNA comes up with (probably just the TNA World Title) will theoretically replace the NWA World Heavyweight Title in the unofficial smark title importance rankings and the world will keep on turning.
John Gregory: BUY. But with some conditions. I think "World Title" status is earned through having your belt defended at least twice overseas. So unlike most smarks, I consider CZW, PWG, and IWA's titles actual world titles. They are nowhere near the stature of WWE, TNA, or ROH. The NWA title has a lot more history than those Indy belts so it has that advantage. But, lest we forget, it also has a dismal history of being worthless between 1994 and 2002, and the only way the NWA will prevent that from happening is putting on someone meaningful, like Danielson, and having him face legitimate contenders around the country, and not someone like "The Pain Doctor from NWA Central Wyoming". Whether they can do that will remain to be seen, but if they can, I'd still consider it a World Title until they screw that up.
The first edition of BUY or SELL finishes at 4 for 6. Stay tuned for next week when two new men will go head to head with a whole new set of topics.
