411 Fact or Fiction 04.13.07: Vince/Lashley, CM Punk, Hogan/Savage, More

Posted by Ashish on 04.12.2007

It's week ONE HUNDRED AND TWENTY FOUR of Fact or Fiction with Stuart Carapola, Ari Berenstein, and whether WWE needs to release Snitsky...

Welcome back to another week of 411 Fact or Fiction: Wrestling Edition! This week, 411 Wrestling regulars Stuart Carapola and Ari Berenstein go at it!


1. The Vince McMahon/Bobby Lashley feud has gone on too long.

Stuart Carapola: FICTION. This feud has gone a long way toward turning Bobby Lashley into a star. When he jumped from Smackdown to ECW, he went from being a midcarder in the shadow of Batista to the champion of the distant third string brand. What's more, he wasn't exactly setting the world on fire with his title defenses. Inserting him into the Vince McMahon-Donald Trump WM match turned him into a headliner overnight. Say what you will about Vince, but being put into a program with him turns a wrestler into a big deal, and it's become clear that he's somebody they see as a future star. At this point, I wouldn't think it'd be unreasonable to say that his popularity has eclipsed that of Batista. I certainly think feuding with Vince McMahon is a big part of this change, and I think that the more the feud goes on (and the less Lashley says) it's only going to help him more and more, and to be honest, I'd rather see him spend the rest of the year feuding with Vince McMahon than with Gene Snitsky.

Ari Berenstein: FICTION. Although it's very close for my tastes, simply because we are stuck in yet ANOTHER endless and repetitious "McMahon authority figure vs. uprising wrestler / defender of the proletariat" angle. As it stands, this is already too derivative of so many WWE storylines of the past year. As George Jetson used to say, "Jane, get me off of this crazy thing!" I would rather see Lashley do something else (looks at Snitsky)...well, maybe not. For some reason though, this evil authority angle has worked better than other and more recent such storylines, including Cena vs. Bischoff. I agree with Stu that Lashley has been elevated through his involvement in the feud, although I'm not so sure about popularity given that two weeks ago on Raw fans were heading to the door and booing Bobby during his main event imbroglio against Umaga and Estrada. Ultimately, I think WWE has some more storyline paths to take in this feud and could probably go another two to three months without the whole thing becoming too long.

Score: 1 for 1


2. A Hulk Hogan vs. Jerry Lawler match on the indie scene, away from WWE and other major promotions, is good for the wrestling industry.

Stuart Carapola: FICTION. I don't think it's good for the wrestling industry, but at the same time I don't think it'll be bad. I just don't think it's going to have any effect at all. Assuming Hogan actually makes it to the match without "injuring himself" again, it's going to be a local attraction and that's it. It'll be like when Shawn Michaels made that one time return match in 2000 for TWA, nothing spectacular's going to happen outside of him simply appearing, and it's not going to have any effect whatsoever on the industry as a whole. It'll just be a curiosity for longtime Memphis fans who have heard "Jerry Lawler beat Hogan in Memphis" for 25 years.

Ari Berenstein: FICTION. I agree with Stu. I doubt this will have any real impact at all on the wrestling world unless the show sells out and becomes a smash success. Given the current independent wrestling scene, where 1,500 fans paid attendance is something special, I doubt this one will take. I know Hogan would want to prove something here to WWE about "where the power lies" (points to hand) but I don't think he'll get there. That may just further enable WWE and that certainly isn't good for the wrestling industry. Oh and by the way, you don't think Hogan is doing this match to get his win back? What's that Ultimate Warrior...I couldn't understand you with all your talk of destrucity. OH YES. Holloween Havoc 1998. The less said about that the better.

Score: 2 for 2


3. A second hour of Impact would increase Impact's overall rating right away.

Stuart Carapola: FICTION. The simple fact is that nothing has an overnight effect on ratings. The only way they could pop a big (or even reasonable) rating right away would be to do something huge like make a Christian vs. Joe match for the title on the first two hour episode and have Joe win. The problem is that even then, it would pop a big rating for that week, but in order to maintain it, they'd have to come up with something to follow that up with, and I don't see that from this creative team. The good news is that with the second hour, it'd give them more time to properly build feuds without having Jim Cornette come out to the ring and announce five matches two weeks before the PPV, but that's something that'll take the fans a little time to get used to, and for a show that's only pulling in the low 1's right now, I don't see a huge change just because of the second hour. Besides, the way things are booked right now, for me it'd be like saying "Oh, you think that the booking is nonsensical, the finishes are unsatisfying, and the wrong people go over? Good, because now we're going to give you twice as much of it!"

Ari Berenstein: FICTION. I mean, do I really need to add anything more to what Stu said? I completely and 100 percent agree with him here. TNA could have the Second Coming and the ratings wouldn't budge beyond its 1.2 - 1.3 high watermark. And by Second Coming I mean that of The Iron Sheik! Seriously, without major league advertising in many markets and quality programming (i.e. the exact opposite, in general, of what they offer now), TNA is just not going to get any larger than where they are at right now.

Score: 3 for 3


---SWITCH!!!---


4. Turning CM Punk heel is the right move.

Ari Berenstein: FACT. Absolutely. First off, I'm glad to see Punk got his Wrestlemania moment as a face, because it is a great and true success story. I was so thrilled to be able to see Punk make it to Wrestlemania. However, Punk's decision about his alignment with either the Originals or the New Breed really couldn't be delayed much longer than post Wrestlemania 23. Given that this is not just a fake out by Punk for storyline reasons and is a legitimate heel turn, this is the right time to do so. Punk is a good face but he is an incredible heel. His past history as the heel in IWA:MS, ROH and FIP speaks for itself. Fans can get behind Punk's need for "competition" and cheer that on, but Punk's "straight edge-better than you" attitude took the backseat for the past year. Now Punk can get into that side of his character and really make people hate him while simultaneously providing some intriguing storylines. I really can't wait to see what Punk has to say as a heel about Sandman and RVD, and quite frankly I'd love to see either match up in the ring (yes, even a match against The Sandman). Besides, how many more times can Punk fight Stevie Richards? As a heel, there's a whole new crop of guys Punk can fight. Of course, Punk will turn face again eventually, but it was definitely time to turn him heel and I think he will come out even better for it.

Stuart Carapola: FACT. I agree with Ari that it was time for the turn, but I've been saying all along that Punk makes an awesome heel, and he's shown with the Second City Saints that he can be very entertaining when he has a group of flunkies to boss around. I think that while the average WWE fan might be disappointed to see him turn, I think they'll be surprised to see just what he's capable of as a heel.

Score: 4 for 4


5. Snitsky should be released from WWE.

Ari Berenstein: FICTION. Why? Is it because he's a horrible wrestler who relies on the traditional boring big man moveset? Is it because he's so hideously ugly that if he is caught from the right wrong angle that he could simultaneously destroy millions of televisions all around the world? Oh wait, I'm supposed to be answering for fiction, right, right. Look, I don't like Snitsky and YOU may not like Snitsky, but the fact of the matter is that Snitsky right now has a role to play in the company. He is the monster heel of ECW and the biggest man on that roster. If you look around the ECW roster, there is no one else who fills that need. AND you didn't hear if from me...but the horror movie angle isn't a bad way to go with Snitsky (although Kane got to it first, but it wasn't his fault). An encounter with Lashley is inevitable but doesn't seem to be happening soon given the McMahon feud is taking dominance of the TV product. Therefore Snitsky is hanging in the background for right now and like Planet Earth, remains "mostly harmless." That's good enough for me right now.

Stuart Carapola: FICTION. Again, I agree with Ari that while he may be a horrible wrestler, the idea of releasing Gene Snitsky is a bit extreme. As much as I like to joke about people like Funaki and Scotty 2 Hotty still having jobs despite having no visible benefit to being around, it really does bother me to see people say that somebody deserves to be released because they're a bad wrestler or boring, or whatever.

Score: 5 for 5


6. One final Hulk Hogan vs. Randy Savage match would still have drawing power.

Ari Berenstein: FICTION. See this one is tricky because Hogan is fighting Jerry Lawler real soon in Memphis. Well, it remains to be seen if it actually goes down, but I happen to think it will. There doesn't seem to be all that much buzz nationally for that match and I'd think that it would be. With the doubt that Hogan will come through in the clutch for these matches (when he's backed off of other independent dates before, as well as TNA), If Hogan vs. Lawler fails to draw in the 19.000 seats Fed Ex Arena, I don't think Hogan vs. Savage would have much of a chance of success either. Also, I doubt that Hogan vs. Savage could capture the attention or the imagination of today's wrestling audience. Not to mention these men are waaay past their primes. Do you remember The Huckster vs. Nacho Man parody match? That was over ten years ago! In 2007, I'd think another match between those two could actually play out like that match. There is one caveat in that if this match takes place in WWE, then this could really take off quickly, but what are the chances of that happening? Next to nothing considering WWE's policy of ignoring Savage's very existence and Vince McMahon's current lover's quarrel with Hogan.

Stuart Carapola: FACT. The funny thing is that Randy Savage floated into my mind as soon as I saw the announcement that Jerry Lawler vs. Hulk Hogan was indeed going to happen in Memphis. While the match that came to mind was another Lawler vs. Savage match, I think this might be even better. Now, the caveat is that I think it would draw well if promoted by WWE because the fact is that they've got a proven track record of successfully promoting big matches. They were fighting each other constantly in WCW, but it's been seven years since their last match, and as Hogan's nostalgia run in WWE has shown, if you give it enough time, the classics can draw again.

Score: 5 for 6


These two finish 5 for 6! Join us next week for more Fact or Fiction!