411 ROH Roundtable Preview: Hartford & New York, 5/11 & 5/12
Posted by Samuel Berman on 05.10.2007
The 411 staff takes an in-depth look at this weekend's ROH shows, featuring one of the biggest tag team matches in ROH history, the return of "American Dragon" Bryan Danielson, and Ring of Honor's first-ever Pay Per View taping!
Hello readers and welcome to this week's 411 Ring of Honor Roundtable Preview. This weekend marks the beginning of ROH's venture into the world of Pay Per View as well as the first show since TNA announced it's recent talent pull. Though some major matches have been booked for Friday's Hartford show, nothing solid has been announced for Saturday's PPV taping, leaving our staff to discuss some general questions about ROH's present and future in lieu of match-by-match previews. Before we get to the actual preview, let's meet this week's contributing 411 writers:
Stuart Carapola, of The Ominous Thoughts News Report and Friendly Competition,
And me, Samuel Berman, of The Independent Mid-Card and occasional other things.
Now that we've had some introductions, let's get to this week's previews. Friday's card is complete as of Monday, 5/8.
ROH REBORN AGAIN
FRIDAY, MAY 11, 2007 – HARTFORD, CT
Adam Pearce vs. Bobby Fish
Stuart Carapola: Bobby Fish? Never heard of him.
Winner: Adam Pearce
Matt Adamson: Seeing as I've never seen Bobby Fish wrestle, I'm going to have to go with the established guy here. Pearce has done well lately and unless this is a joke, he's gonna win this one.
Winner: Adam Pearce
Bayani Domingo: I'd love to see Shark Boy interfere in this match as the first major TNA defect to RoH.
Winner: Pearce, because he's not a "fish".
Michael Bauer: Who exactly is Bobby Fish? I rest my case.
Winner: Adam Pearce
Ari Berenstein: I've seen exactly one match with Bobby Fish and I really haven't seen enough of him to forma judgment. He should get a good chance here, but inevitably this will turn into what it really is, which is a squash match. I will avoid making the obvious joke about Bobby Fish "sleeping with the fishes." Oh wait.
Winner: Adam Pearce
Jake Ziegler: I have never heard of Bobby Fish, and I don't expect him to pull out an upset here.
Winner: Adam Pearce
Brad Garoon: I don't know anything about Bobby Fish except for the fact that he's seemingly lower on the ROH pecking order than Jason Blade in the new Reborn Again universe. No brainer here.
Winner: Adam Pearce
Samuel Berman: I'm going with the "Scrap Daddy". Drive through.
Winner: Adam Pearce
411 Staff Picks: Adam Pearce (8-0)
Kevin Steen & El Generico vs. Eddie Edwards & Jason Blade
Stuart Carapola: Squash city, baby. Steen & Generico have really been impressing me this year, and I don't think they're going to lose to the Jobber Twins on their way to a showdown with the Briscoes for the ROH World Tag Team Title.
Winner: Kevin Steen & El Generico
Matt Adamson: I have no officially seen Jason Blade wrestle. Last week I had the chance to see Buffalo Stampede and A Night of Tribute and he wrestled on one of those shows. So memorably in fact that I can't remember which one. Needless to say it didn't leave an especially good or bad impression. This match is Blade and Edwards against the PWG powerhouse of El Generico and Steen. Shouldn't be too much work for the PWG champ and Steen to take care of business.
Winners: El Generico and Kevin Steen
Bayani Domingo: I am really scared with the push Steen and Generico are getting in RoH because if they do in fact get "contracts" they'll be RoH wrestlers first and PWG wrestlers second. That being said I can't imagine them losing to Blade and Edwards for no good reason. Steen and Generico are really the only clear cut tag team left to face off with the Briscoes so it looks like another clean win for these two.
Winner: El Steen-erico
Michael Bauer: Edwards and Blade are kinda just being thrown together here, but they could be a surprise in the tag team division. But this is Steen and Generico, a team I still do not understand for the life of me, and they seemed poised to be going after the Tag team Titles, maybe as soon as Saturday's PPV taping.
Winner: Kevin Steen and Generico
Ari Berenstein: The Card-bored Connection returns to action here. After getting a completely unjustified win against Hero and Tolland last month in Edison, it's safe to say I wouldn't put an upset past the booking. Suffice to sat, if Edwards and Blade win, I riot. Steen and Generico are the defacto number one contenders due to their win over The Briscoes on 4/12/07 and they should keep the momentum going with a win here.
Winners: Steen and Generico
Jake Ziegler: Steen & Generico have already beaten the Briscoes and could possibly have more of a role in ROH with some of the recent departures. That's why I see them beating the New England team of Eddie Edwards & Jason Blade, who may also wind up getting on more shows.
Winner: Kevin Steen & El Generico
Brad Garoon: Edwards & Blade surprised me with a win over the more promising team of Hero and Toland last time around. I wasn't wild about the match that saw Steen and Generico return to the company, but everyone else has been and they have a title shot coming up. I do like the angle between Mark Briscoe and Kevin Steen, so they get the advantage here.
Winners: Steen & Generico
Samuel Berman: I've got to go with the Canadians here, if only because they're already in a pseudo-feud with the Briscoes.
Winners: Kevin Steen & El Generico
411 Staff Picks: Kevin Steen & El Generico (8-0)
Jimmy Rave vs. Pelle Primeau
Stuart Carapola: Jimmy Rave's in a really tough spot right now because while he got a loto f heel heat when he was in the Embassy, a lot of that had to do with Prince Nana. Since the Embassy's been disbanded, I'd say that Rave's heat has been almost nonexistent. The fans just don't care about him anymore, and a string of victories over Nigel McGuinness did nothing to change that. At a time when ROH is looking to move on to its second generation of homegrown talent, I think this would be a good time to start thinking about shuffling Rave out the door and having him put over a young guy with potential. That said, he's just back from injury and Gabe is determined to get him over if it kills him, so he'll probably get his win back from the loss in Six Man Mayhem.
Winner: Jimmy Rave
Matt Adamson: Pelle Primeau is a guy to look out for in the future, but the future isn't going to happen right now. A win over Rave would elevate him a good deal, but Rave needs to get back into the mix of things, and here's that opportunity.
Winner: Jimmy Rave
Bayani Domingo: Heel hook. That's all you gotta know Pelle my man.
Winner: Jimmy Rave
Michael Bauer: So Jimmy Rave is back from injury and the first guy he faces is the current King of the Class trophy holder. No offense Pelle, but there is no way you are winning this one.
Winner: Jimmy Rave
Ari Berenstein: Two years ago, Pelle would have had no chance. Last year, Pelle would have had…no chance. This year? Pelle has half a chance.
Winner: Jimmy Rave
Jake Ziegler: Pelle pinned Rave back in October, and I think Rave will get the win back. It's nice to see Primeau getting a bigger role lately, but Rave is still going to win here.
Winner: Jimmy Rave
Brad Garoon: It's hard for me to say anything about Rave without thinking about him throwing up all over the ring. That image is burned into my mind forever. I'm loving the Primeau angle, and a win over the very hot Jimmy Rave would be enough to boost him into the midcard. With ROH going through a rebuilding phase this would be a perfect time to try to give Pelle a little more than 5 minutes per match. If I were in charge I wouldn't even go the Mikey Whipwreck route. I've always had this idea where a smaller wrestler would have one move that would destroy every opponent, even ones much bigger and stronger. If they could convincingly sell Primeau's stunner as such, or give him a new move, I know I'd be entertained. I'm going to give him the win here and hope it comes true.
Winner: Pelle Primeau
Samuel Berman: I was going to do the whole ‘Mikey Whipwreck' comparison, but Brad went and stole my thunder. Great minds think alike, yada, yada, yada. Re-read Brad's thoughts if you must and then insert my name before them. Oh, and Rave is totally uninteresting to me since 2007 started. Remember how hot an act he was after feuding with Punk? Or how awesome his match with Danielson last year was? Yeah, me neither.
Winner: Pelle Primeau
411 Staff Picks: Jimmy Rave (6-2)
Winner Gets an ROH Contract: Claudio Castagnoli vs. BJ Whitmer
Stuart Carapola: Didn't both these guys already have ROH contracts? Like, isn't that why Claudio was still around after the CZW feud ended? Or are these new contracts? And if Whitmer didn't have a contract, how's he stuck around all this time? ROH doesn't usually ignore its own storylines like this, but whatever, it should make for a good match.
Winner: Claudio Castagnoli
Matt Adamson: Seriously, since when did Whitmer not have a contract or agreement (like they have the set of contracts out there anyway) with ROH? I can understand Claudio not having one yet, but BJ? He's been with ROH for what seems like forever, only taking extended time off when he was injured. Well, something tells me Castagnoli is going to come out on top of this one and earn himself an "ROH Contract" Strange as it sounds.
Winner: Claudio Castagnoli
Bayani Domingo: Wow, a lot is at stake, however only one of these guys I care to even watch in RoH. Sadly this also means that RoH will have the allegiance of another PWG fav of mine. Damn you East Coasters stealing all the talent.
Winner: HEY!! Claudio.
Michael Bauer: I don't understand this whole RoH contract deal, but you gotta believe that Claudio is more valuable to Ring of Honor than BJ Whitmer. I mean, didn't Claudio almost go to the WWE?
Winner: Claudio Ca$tagnoli
Ari Berenstein: ROH is usually a lot better with keeping continuity with the booking. Why do either of these guys need to fight for a contract? Claudio had one coming out of the angle with CZW. If BJ Whitmer needs to fight for a contract in the wake of all he did for ROH in that war against CZW, then something is seriously fucked up with the storyline braintrust at ROH. Then again, that is why I've dubbed them the Keystone Cops. Anyway, this should be a good match as Claudio has really upped his game lately and Whitmer is also on a roll in recent performances.
Winner: Claudio Castagnoli
Jake Ziegler: This one really could go either way, as I anticipate both guys being a part of the ROH roster for the foreseeable future. I'm tempted to say Claudio because he was for a time signed to WWE so ROH may be worried he could go, but my gut tells me they'll give it to the man who defended ROH in the CZW war.
Winner: BJ Whitmer
Brad Garoon: Remember back in 2002 when ROH had contract matches all the time? I wonder if Michael Shane and CM Punk and Sal Rinauro and Spanky's contracts ended before they left the company. Is there anyone who doesn't believe that both of these guys are going to be ROH contracted wrestlers in the long run? Anyway, Whitmer needs a big win to get back into the swing of things. These two actually match up kind of well and a feud over the contract could be more exciting than just a one-off match between them. That being said I hope this goes to a draw or a no-contest, but to be safe I'll make a pick.
Winner: BJ Whitmer
Samuel Berman: Didn't they already announce Whitmer as having a contract? I guess I'd give one to Claudio because he's the bigger flight risk (that is, if I had to choose between these two guys), but the announcement would seem to indicate writing on a wall or something of that nature.
Winner: BJ Whitmer
411 Staff Picks: Claudio Castagnoli (5-3)
"American Dragon" Bryan Danielson has an Open Contract
Stuart Carapola: Danielson's break after Final Battle was the right move to make, not only was he injured but after being the ROH World Champion for 15 months they really ran out of people to put him against. This is not a problem now because ROH is chock full of new talent, giving Danielson plenty of new people to work with. Would I like to see him regain the ROH Title? I definitely think that's going to happen in the future, but not right away and as much as I know people are dying to see that match, I don't think he'll be the one to beat Morishima. I can't wait to see who his first opponent back is going to be, but I think we can all pretty much agree that he's not going to lose.
Winner: Bryan Danielson
Matt Adamson: I'm very please that Danielson has returned. Not only because now the Pay Per View world will be able to experience his in-ring greatness, but because the Pay Per View world needs to experience his in-ring greatness. I figure this is a way to get him on the show, and regardless of who he faces, I'd imagine he'll be the one to win.
Winner: Bryan Danielson
Bayani Domingo: Danielson won't lose here, but it's intriguing to see who will step up. My guess is an outsider, someone new to RoH that Gabe has been able to entice over via the new PPV set up. So of course we have to go with a random surprise. My guess? Xavier. That would be quite the mind f**k wouldn't it?
Winner: Daniel-san
Michael Bauer: I really hate picking mystery matches, but here is goes.
Winner: Bryan Danielson over The man known as "Sugarfoot"
Ari Berenstein: The Son of the Return of the American Dragon! I can't wait for Danielson to return and I think the fans will really take to him once again. He and Nigel have become ROH's great white hope (and that is NOT a comment about Danielson's pasty white skin). I am blanking out on a possible opponent here; maybe Shane Hagadorn can come in and get his ass handed back to him.
Winner: Bryan Danielson
Jake Ziegler: Whoever Danielson faces, I think it would be insane to have him lose his comeback match.
Winner: Bryan Danielson
Brad Garoon: I saw someone mention somewhere that they thought Danielson would be the new leader of the Resilience. I honestly hope that's true and that he changes the name of the group to The Final Countdown. Anything that leads to more matches between Danielson and Strong is alright with me. If that's not what happens then I have no idea who will answer. Nobody else is scheduled without a match and the six-man match also has a mystery competitor element to it.
Winner: N/A
Samuel Berman: Yeah, I'm pretty frustrated that Brad stole all of my ideas this week. Actually I'm 50/50 on the next match, but now I'm getting ahead of myself. Just call this question a no contest for me and move along.
Roderick Strong, Davey Richards & Rocky Romero vs. Matt Cross, Erick Stevens & ?????
Stuart Carapola:My first reaction to this match was that the No Remorse Corps has dominated the Resilience every step of the way, and now without Aries they probably stand no chance. However, this could be a good match for them to make a statement by bringing on a new member and then go on to score what I believe would be their first win over the NRC. No idea who the mystery man is going to be, but I think this is the night the Resilience turns it around.
Winner: Matt Cross, Erick Stevens & ?????
Matt Adamson: I almost decided against my usual "pick the team with ?????" rule, but somebody from the Resilience is going to have to take the NRC down. Maybe ????? will be the guy.
Winners: ????? and company.
Bayani Domingo: The Resilience has to do something here, otherwise the whole faction war is for not considering Jack is in Japan at the moment. I think we'll either see a big surprise here by Chris Hero (suck on that one Ari) leading the group or Aries will find a way out of his contract in time.
Winner: Cross, Stevens, & ?????
Michael Bauer: Well, this is very interesting since Aries looks to be out do to the deal with TNA. But I wouldn't be surprised if he is still in this match, then again, I seriously doubt it. The No Remorse Corps have totally dominated this feud and it is time for that to change. What better way to do it with a possible new leader and a huge win in the process?
Winner: The "New" Resilience
Ari Berenstein: I am of the mindset that there won't be a third man on the side of The Resilience and that they will have to fight this match three on two. If that happens, then no amount of resilience will be able to overcome those odds. The NRC keep strong heading into the PPV.
Winner: No Remorse Corps
Jake Ziegler: This could actually be where Bryan Danielson's open contract comes into play. Cross & Stevens need a leader, and Danielson could get right back into the thick of things by joining this hot feud in place of Austin Aries. Whoever joins the team, I do predict a Resiliance win.
Winner: Matt Cross, Erick Stevens & ?????
Brad Garoon: Like I said before, Danielson being the missing Resilience member makes sense given his past rivalry with Strong and the fact that it fits perfectly as far as the lineup goes. With a new member in tow the Resilience (hopefully soon to be called The Final Countdown) will need a big win to show that the new dynamic works. I'm very excited to see this match on DVD for the Strong/Stevens and possible Strong/Danielson exchanges.
Winners: Cross, Stevens and friend.
Samuel Berman: I think one of two things will happen. 1) Austin Aries will make a ‘surprise' appearance and rejoin his Resilience members to one of the biggest pops in ROH history (and no, I'm not joking about that last part). 2) Bryan Danielson walks out and "officially" turns face as the new leader of the Resilience, taking Aries' place as the cagey veteran who wants to lead the next generation of ROH stars. I actually think this will totally depend on what Aries' status is by Friday and that Gabe has two well-mapped-out ways he could go based on that.
Winners: Erick Stevens, Matt Cross & either Austin Aries or Bryan Danielson
411 Staff Picks: Erick Stevens, Matt Cross & ?????
411 Staff Consensus Prediction for Stevens & Cross' Partner: Bryan Danielson or Austin Aries
Matt Sydal vs. Naomichi Marufuji
Stuart Carapola: If Sydal's match with KENTA is any indication, this is going to be a really good match. I don't expect Sydal to win, but this will definitely be another one of those matches where Sydal gets more over by losing strong.
Winner: Naomichi Marufuji
Matt Adamson: This match is going to be awesome. Sydal works a style that seems to gel well with the Japanese Jr's. Marufuji is completely awesome and even if Sydal wasn't, this match would still be great, but Sydal will work out awesome as well. I think it's obvious I'm excited. I always am when my puro stars come to the states.
Winner: Naomichi Marufuji
Bayani Domingo: Sydal to me has good potential, but I can't see him stealing the big win here because he doesn't come off to me as a "Main Event" level guy yet. Then again, they need to create a new "upper crust" in RoH and he has as good a chance as any so. Upset special anyone?
Winner: Sydal
Michael Bauer: Now, I haven't seen the NOAH guy compete, but the way they are coming into Ring of Honor lately, you know that he is no slouch. Sydal though has kinda been under the radar lately and should be due for a win as he starts as a full singles wrestler for RoH. Possible match of the night right here.
Winner: Matt Sydal
Ari Berenstein: Sydal didn't win against KENTA back in November 2006, but he showed some remarkable effort in losing the battle. I expect the same here, but Sydal may become even more over because I feel he and Marufuji can really push the pace and do some incredible stuff in the ring that the fans will love.
Winner: Marufuji
Jake Ziegler: Much like I see a returning Danielson getting a win, with Marufuji being on the next few shows I see wanting to keep him strong.
Winner: Naomichi Marufuji
Brad Garoon: Usually when KENTA & Marufuji wrestle in singles matches on the same show one wins and one loses. Sydal has already lost to KENTA but I just don't see him beating Marufuji here. If he does it'll be step one in pushing him to the top of the card, but I've never seen Sydal as a main event guy. He's just too cheesy on the microphone and too flashy in his matches. I'll give this one to the always entertaining former GHC Heavyweight Champion.
Winner: Naomichi Marufuji
Samuel Berman: Marufuji is coming for an extended tour this year like KENTA did last year, so I think he's the one that gets kept strong. Also, I refuse to pick two wins for the up-and-coming ROH guys, as you'll see in a second.
Winner: Naomichi Marufuji
411 Staff Picks: Naomichi Marufuji (6-2)
Delirious vs. KENTA
Stuart Carapola: This ought to be fun. I've never seen KENTA do any kind of comedy, so I think that him playing off of Delirious and Delirious overselling KENTA's brutal beating is going to be a lot of fun to watch. As for who's going to win, take my comments about the previous match and substitute the appropriate names.
Winner: KENTA
Matt Adamson: More puro goodness means more excitement for me, and more awesome for everybody. This should be an interesting pair up as KENTA is a pretty serious guy while Delirious is... well, you probably know how Delirious is. So, I think KENTA might be thrown off guard but not enough to actually lose the match. It's going to be different and it's going to be interesting, but KENTA is going to win.
Winner: KENTA
Bayani Domingo: On paper this looks like a weird match up but I'm not counting the lizard man out yet. One would think that KENTA would over power Delirious pretty easily but once again RoH needs to establish stars here so…naw, I can't pick against a guy who uses the same move that literally KILLED a vampire last week can I?
Winner: KENTA
Michael Bauer: This should be something as this is not KENTA's first shot in the RoH ring and Delirious has mixed it up with the Japanese Star before. I can't see the Ring of Honor crew taking both matches, so I expect this one to be in the bag.
Winner: KENTA
Ari Berenstein: KENTA may not be able to make heads or tails of Delirious, but it should hardly matter because he will kick D's tail and then kick his head off.
Winner: KENTA
Jake Ziegler: I'm pretty excited to see this match, and I think it could be a really good showcase for Delirious. However, I just don't see him pulling out such a high profile opponent.
Winner: KENTA
Brad Garoon: Like I said before, when KENTA wins Marufuji loses and vice versa, and before I said I though both NOAH imports would win. On second thought however I could see this as Delirious's push to the main event, where I can't see the same thing happening for Sydal. Delirious is perpetually over with the ROH fans and has had ROH main event style matches with Bryan Danielson before. It's a risky bet but I'm going to go with the bizarre one here, getting the biggest win of his career and leading perhaps to another big match on the PPV taping.
Winner: Delirious
Samuel Berman: Oh, come on Brad! I really wanted to be the only one who picked Delirious to win here, but again, Brad just goes and does it first. Looking at the whole picture here, I like Matt Sydal, but I don't think it's a coincidence that Delirious has already had a handful of ROH World Title shots and Sydal hasn't. Delirious is one of the guys that ROH needs to push to the moon in this new PPV era because he's not only an interesting and funny character, but has the goods in the ring. Sydal is good in the ring, but is light years behind Delirious in the charisma and character development departments. KENTA pays ROH back for going over its original icon and its World Champion (twice) since debuting in 2005 and lays down for the masked man.
Winner: Delirious
411 Staff Picks: KENTA (6-2)
ROH World Tag Team Titles: Jay & Mark Briscoe (c) vs. Takeshi Morishima & Nigel McGuinness
Stuart Carapola: I don't expect Morishima to walk out of Reborn Again with both titles, but what I can tell you is that I'm expecting this to be a brutally stiff match. Nigel's obviously there to take the fall, but I think it'll be interesting to see how Nigel and Morishima work together after killing each other in New Jersey last month.
Winner: Jay & Mark Briscoe
Matt Adamson: The Briscoe's are on an incredible roll lately, and as daunting as the team of Morishima & McGuiness appears, they are going to continue on their roll. I can't imagine Morishima holding both ROH titles leaving this show, and since his title isn't on the line, the Briscoe's will walk out still the champions for now.
Winners: The Briscoes
Bayani Domingo: Yikes, if there was ever a match that showcased what RoH is really about now it is this. If the Briscoes lose then RoH has no idea what they are doing because they ARE tag team wrestling in RoH and without them the rest of the division looks thinner than HBK's hairline.
Winner: Briscoe Bros.
Michael Bauer: Nigel and Takeshi should be fighting each other again, not tagging up to go after the Tag Team Titles. The Briscoes are Tag Team Wrestling in the RoH and there is no way in hell they should lose the belts here. I doubt this will have a clean ending, as Steen and Generico will get involved to give the DQ finish we hate to see, but it will be needed. Morishima can't lose clean and Nigel shouldn't lose clean.
Winner: The Briscoes by DQ.
Ari Berenstein: The Briscoes are the pre-eminent team of Ring of Honor and should head into the pay per view still holding the titles. They had a huge win and a great match against Alex Shelley and Chris Sabin and I think a win against the NOAH tandem of Morishima and McGuinness will secure the reputation of The Briscoes for the long haul. This is the main event in the next new era of ROH action and all four men are going to have to step it up and deliver a huge main event. Therefore, I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that the unexpected will happen. Morishima will take his first pinfall loss since winning the ROH World Title. This would lead to what I think is the natural main event for the pay per view, that is, McGuinness vs. Morishima II.
Winner: The Briscoes
Jake Ziegler: I'll talk more about the Briscoe Brothers later on, but suffice to say this match should be a little on the stiff side. Morishima and Nigel are NOAH rivals, even though they did have a reportedly brutal match a few weeks ago in New Jersey. I don't think Morishima is going to hold two titles, and I think the Briscoes will be champions for a long time, so the result seems obvious.
Winner: Jay & Mark Briscoe
Brad Garoon: There's no questions that the tag champs will retain here. The question is whether this match will lead to a renewed intensity between Nigel and Morishima heading into what seems to be a lock of a title match in Japan. I figure Nigel will take the fall here as I predicted that KENTA may drop one earlier, and we all know that NOAH wins and losses on a show are all linked. This match should be phenomenal and will hopefully lead to a rematch between the Briscoes and KENTA/Marufuji the following night in front of a hot New York crowd.
Winners: The Briscoes
Samuel Berman: I'm just going to assume that this match will be incredibly good, as everything Briscoe-related has been since the start of the year. There is nothing to be gained from giving the belts to Nigel and Morishima and furthermore, the tag belts just got hotshotted around during the Fifth Year Festival. It would be unwise in my estimation to turn the Briscoes into the guys who can win the belts, but can't keep them. Though a lot of people think that Nigel will take the fall here, I'm going against the grain and picking Jay to pin Morishima with the precedent being the series of matches between the Briscoes and Samoa Joe during Joe's title reign. Both brothers were able to pin the supposedly unbeatable champion during Tag Team Title defenses because that was their environment and Joe wasn't as good of a tag team wrestler as he was in defenses of his title. Jay vs. Morishima for the ROH World Title in Chicago? I can only hope, I suppose.
Winners and STILL ROH World Tag Team Champions: Jay & Mark Briscoe
411 Staff Picks: Jay & Mark Briscoe (8-0)
ROH RESPECT IS EARNED
SATURDAY, MAY 12, 2007 – NEW YORK, NY
Do you think Ring of Honor's move to Pay Per View is coming at the right time?
Stuart Carapola: I do, they've basically hit the wall of how much they can grow given their current live event/DVD business model, and I think that if they want to take that next step in the growth of the company, this is a great move. ROH has never been marks for TV or live PPV, but if they've hit a point where they say "We've gone as far as we can go unless we move to a new medium", then I think it's the right move.
Matt Adamson: I can't honestly think of a better time. They have give a lot of attention to the guys on their roster who don't have a contract with TNA. This has made it possible to avoid that difficult situation of trying to fill the holes. With the return of Bryan Danielson and the presence of a lot of extremely talented Japanese wrestlers, this is the opportune time to make a move like this.
Bayani Domingo: To be honest, they could have waited another month or so in order to utilize Sabin/Shelley a little better till reinforcements arrived, and they should have straightened out Aries' situation better as well having Jack Evans back in the fold, but strike while the iron is hot I guess. So even though I think they could have waited a bit longer they apparently felt this was the best time so I won't question Gabe and Silikin's decision…because at least they never gave me an electrified fence match.
Michael Bauer: It's hard to say if it is coming at the right time, but it is coming at the needed time. The Ring of Honor is already ahead of TNA's range of scope and TNA has been on primetime for a while now with Pay Per Views for years. TNA hasn't been to Japan or England, Ring of Honor has done both. And for a "third" federation to go for television time, it could end up as bad as ECW when Paul Heyman was trying to land a television deal. The only logical step forward was to go to Pay Per View. Now I just hope it costs the price of the DVDs I always buy.
Ari Berenstein: I don't know about "the right time" but I don't think there is such a thing in ROH's situation. ROH was used to doing business a certain way and could have gone about doing so to varying degrees of success and profit for some time. I as a fan wouldn't have minded a bit, because it would ensure the continued existence of ROH for a long time to come. Cary Silkin however, has a business to run and ultimately as a business man he wants to make a profit and show growth. I don't think ROH had a choice at this point but to go into PPV. Losing all the TNA signed talent was inevitable and hastened by TNA pulling Joe and Daniels, among others. At that point, the opportunity is out there to do something more with the product and in my opinion, you have to take the risk.
Jake Ziegler: In one word, yes. It had to happen sooner or later, and with so many fans put off by TNA's PPV offerings, now is as good a time as any. Even with the shows coming out on DVD, fans will still buy the show, and it can only add new fans. Gabe Sapolsky has said that the style will not change, so this can only have positive effects.
Brad Garoon: Yes, although a PPV taping leaves something to be desired. While it will be a great money-making venture and a good source of advertising for DVDs, a live PPV is what would have changed the company from the country's biggest indy to a national force. Plenty of companies have had taped PPVs air without much success following them. That being said ROH owner Cary Silkin has said that ROH went as far as it could under the business model they were operating with, which makes this move the right one at the right time.
Samuel Berman: It's hard to argue with Cary Silkin's view that ROH had expanded as much as it was going to under the live shows and DVD releases model that they were using up until this week. Hopefully the whole ‘no pressure to produce buys' stipulation remains in place for a while, because while I think this move will increase ROH's visibility (and really, how could it not?), I don't think that Ring of Honor is all of a sudden going to be the next major national company. If the PPV companies hold up their end of the bargain, ROH will certainly hold up its responsibility to provide an entertaining two-hour show every couple of months.
Which of the recently departed talents will be the most sorely missed by ROH in terms of the in-ring product?
Stuart Carapola: Austin Aries, no question. The guy went from being hated for taking the ROH Title from Samoa Joe to being one of the most popular boys with the crowd and one hell of an amazing in-ring talent. The guy can do it all, and if they ever decided to make anyone the first two-time ROH World Champion, I think Aries would have been a perfect choice. It still remains to be seen exactly how things play out with his TNA contract so he might not be gone all that long, but as for right now I think he was far more important to the in-ring workrate than Homicide, Joe, or Daniels.
Matt Adamson: I'd have to say it's a tie between Aries, Samoa Joe and Homicide. Aries gets the slight advantage though due to him apparent loyalty to ROH. While I think Homicide and Joe were likely to go with TNA, I believe Aries if given the choice would have stayed with ROH. If you put all that aside, I think clearly the best in-ring work came from Joe over his years with ROH. His series with Punk and just about every match he was in was top notch and interesting, He'll certainly be missed.
Bayani Domingo: If you believe Aries will be back in RoH by the no later than June, which I do, then you'd have to go with Shelley and Sabin. The Tag Division right now is in shambles. You have the Briscoes on top and everyone else as a close 3rd. Steen-erico are the next contenders but after them you have Edwards/Blade and a cast of thrown together teams. Shelley and Sabin vs the Briscoes could have produced so many great matches that it's a shame RoH won't get the chance to showcase them.
Michael Bauer: You may be surprised to here this, but it's not Sabin and Shelley, since they only just came back to the fold. And while Aries was huge with the whole gang warfare in the current Ring of Honor, he can be replaced, but I'm still holding out hope to doesn't need to be. No, the person who will be missed most is Homicide. Watch any show form the past few months, Homicide is without a shadow of a doubt the most over wrestler on the roster. Yes, more than the Briscoes, Nigel, or anyone else. Not to mention, we will never get that rematch of Danielson vs. Homicide which would have been huge.
Ari Berenstein: Austin Aries is a close second, but when I think "heart and soul" of ROH, it's most definitely Joe I think of. Samoa Joe almost always delivered the goods, and as a perpetual main eventer he was a guaranteed money drawing headliner. In the ring, Joe has had so many epic matches. He could bring the "heavyweight" style marquee fight, but he could also work comedy and tag matches. ROH is going to miss his versatility and more importantly his name value, which can extend to more fans closer to the "mainstream" who know of him from TNA and know the quality level of his matches.
Jake Ziegler: I think most will probably say Austin Aries, and to a certain extent I agree, but I'm more personally inclined to say Colt Cabana. Cabana could do comedy as well as serious matches (as the feuds with Homicide and Jimmy Jacobs proved), and Aries is a little repetitive and overrated to me.
Brad Garoon: While Homicide and Daniels were big names in ROH, and the prospect of a Joe/Morishima rematch made Joe's insane win over the champ in February make a little bit of sense, it's the loss of Austin Aries that's going to cause the most pain in terms of both in-ring performances and from a storyline perspective. Aries was the leader of the Resilience in the current hottest feud in the company (since Jacobs's injury sidelined him) and he was also the most consistent performing out of the TNA contracted guys. Look no further than he recent match against Morishima for proof of that. Homicide hasn't had a great match since he won the title and Daniels never puts on fantastic matches anymore. I'd been calling for the TNA guys to leave (that includes Joe) since Homicide lost the belt, and now that they're gone ROH will have the flexibility to grow with new, more home-grown stars.
Samuel Berman: Discounting Samoa Joe, who was already out of the company as a full-timer by the time this announcement was made, then I'm left to choose between "Classic" Colt Cabana, Homicide or Austin Aries. Losing Christopher Daniels, Shingo and the recently-debuted MCMG is a shame, but all three seemed in the works separate from the PPV announcement/TNA talent pull and thus have less of an impact (no pun intended) on ROH storylines. My heart tells me that Cabana would have been an absolute star in the new PPV format and would have almost instantly gained a cult following along the lines of the biggest stars from the early ECW days. That being said, both former champions have been major players in ROH for as long as anyone can remember. I'm in the school of thought (along with Bayani and others) that Aries will be back in ROH sooner than later, so that leaves Homicide as my default answer. For the record, I already did a whole thing on the staff forums about how Aries could probably clean up on the Independent circuit by adopting a ‘King of the Indies' gimmick where he vocally turns his back on TNA and appears for every company that will have him. Think of it this way: with Joe, Styles, Sabin, Shelley, Homicide, Daniels, Ki, Cabana, Punk, Gibson, London, and Kendrick now all off of the Independent scene, who's the top "name" singles wrestler available for tournaments like BOLA and TPI? If you said ‘Austin Aries', then you're speaking my language.
If you were running Ring of Honor, which five wrestlers would you have given the first contracts to?
Stuart Carapola: Real easy question, it would be Bryan Danielson, Jay Briscoe, Mark Briscoe, Nigel McGuinness, and Roderick Strong. These five men are the core of ROH right now, they've both been with the company for quite some time and have not only proven themselves as all being terrific workers, but professionals who are dedicated to giving their best for ROH every time out. They're also all top guys and people who the fans will pay to see if they've got quality opponents, or maybe even just if they appear. Given that the rest of ROH's top homegrown talent is currently inaccessible, these are the five men they need to have around right now to help bring up the second generation of ROH talent.
Matt Adamson: Bryan Danielson, Jay Briscoe, Mark Briscoe, Claudio Castagnoli and Nigel McGuiness. All five of these guys entertain me a whole heck of a lot, and if they entertain me, they must entertain others as well. Is that McMahon logic right there or what? Maybe I shouldn't run ROH for that very reason.
Bayani Domingo: Easy, Danielson, Strong, McGuinness, and the Briscoe Bros. The Heart, soul, and grit of the company. Danielson is the legitimacy of the company, Strong and McGuinness are the next main event guys and the Briscoes ARE the tag division. Right now Morishima needs to lose the belt to Strong or McGuinness and no one else because I can't see any other guy really ready to step up and be "the man".
Michael Bauer: I'll go one by one here. First and foremost, Nigel McGuinness gets a contract. He is the face of the Ring of Honor now, even if it gets slightly forced on him, as they groom him to be the man to dethrone Morishima. Secondly (and thirdly), I would lock up the Briscoe Brothers. They are quite possibly the most over guys they have left on the roster and are definitely the most popular. Fourth, Roderick Strong gets a contract as there is nobody with as much heel heat than this guy has and RoH needs atleast one person to have that heat. Fifth, believe it or not, Claudio gets one from me. He almost left once for greener pastures and you know if the chance came, he could easily go again. Now, why is Danielson not on my list? The main reason is that everyone I named could be a person the WWE or TNA would look at in terms of size and looks before performance. That is not saying none of them can't perform, because they all can. Now, this takes nothing away from Danielson, but he is just too small for any of the big companies to take an interest in. Plus signing a contract would take him away from Japan, and that is where the biggest mark is being made outside of the United States.
Ari Berenstein: I guess I have to echo everyone's sentiments and go with Danielson, McGuinness and The Briscoes. They are the best in ring talents and the ones with the most name value for ROH advertising. However, I would sign Chris Hero before Roderick Strong. The one weakness of McGuinness and The Briscoes is on the promos. Aside from Danielson, who has completely come into his own with interviews, the other three (and Strong, who is the other favorite of this cohort) are all weaker than they should be at this point in their careers and still have plenty of room to improve their promos. Chris Hero can get under a person's skin just by being there and when he speaks, he has the ability to incite riots. Now, THAT'S heel charisma. However, ROH is first and foremost about the in ring action, and with this group I think we have a great collection of talent who are the best at that and therefore are the most important to sign.
Jake Ziegler: Bryan Danielson, Jay Briscoe, Mark Briscoe, Jack Evans, and Jimmy Jacobs. Danielson's long title reign made him the face of Ring of Honor, and he's one of the few guys to never go for a WWE or TNA contract. He's also one of the best in the world and an easy #1 pick. Jay and Mark Briscoe are the most believable guys around, and their matches are good as singles or as a team. Jack Evans can do things no one can do anywhere, and he'd be a great guy for ROH to focus on. Jimmy Jacobs has gotten to be such an interesting character and I see him doing some big things when he comes back from injury. I would also be in a hurry to sign Nigel McGuinness, Roderick Strong, Matt Sydal, Delirious, BJ Whitmer, Chris Hero, Larry Sweeney, Claudio Castagnoli, Davey Richards, Rocky Romero, Matt Cross, and Erick Stevens.
Brad Garoon: First lets consider all Japanese talent to be safe from TNA and WWE interference due to their obligations to their home promotions. Bryan Danielson has proven to be a reliable wrestler to build a company around, so he gets the first contract. The Briscoes have reinvigorated my love for tag team wrestling, so they get 2 and 3. The company has been building Nigel up as the next ROH ace, so he gets number 4. The last contract would go to Roderick Strong. With the No Remorse Corp behind him and the FIP title around his waste Strong seems poised for a big main event heel push this year. Hopefully that will eventually lead to him winning the ROH World Championship, something I think he's finally ready for. There are plenty of other guys I'd give contracts to also, like Jimmy Jacobs, BJ Whitmer, Delirious, Richards & Romero, Stevens & Cross and a slew of others, but if I had only 5 those are the guys I'd pick.
Samuel Berman: Four of mine are pretty obvious: Jay & Mark Briscoe, Nigel McGuinness and Bryan Danielson. Though everyone else has been listing Roderick Strong (and even though I really like Strong as a wrestler), I'd give my final contract to Delirious, who's gimmick and style make him far more of a flight risk than Roddy. Furthermore, I think it's telling that Delirious' gimmick disallows him from speaking a coherent sentence and yet he's still immeasurably better at cutting promos than Roderick is. I don't mean that to bash Strong, but it's the truth.
How much (if at all) do you think TNA's recent decision to pull their talent will impact Ring of Honor?
Stuart Carapola: Honestly? I don't think it will impact them very much at all. It's been very noticeable how ROH has been booking the guys with TNA contracts in such a way that if TNA suddenly decided to yank everyone again, it wouldn't have a massive impact on their booking direction. They learned very well the lessons of the 2004 situation, and that's why you never saw TNA guys holding titles for any great length of time. Looking at the way storylines were playing out now, what real negative effect did TNA pulling their talent have on ROH? Basically, the Resilience is short one member and Adam Pearce has nobody to feud with, and that's it. It was nice while it lasted, but I think we all knew this would happen again eventually, and apparently so did ROH management.
Matt Adamson: Very little. It seems as though ROH was anticipating that move and in wise fashion prepared for it. We kept thinking it was TNA that was the reason ROH was phasing out their talent when all along it appears as though ROH was preparing for their future. Smart move and it paid off, they were able to get some of the guys they'll be depending on in the future in the spotlight.
Bayani Domingo: A lot. I'm sorry, but look at the top 7 guys in RoH right now: Danielson/Strong/McGuinness/Morishima/Mark&Jay Briscoe/Aries? But TNA has managed to sign away Samoa Joe/Low Ki/AJ/Daniels/Shelley/Homicide/Jay Lethal. You have to admit, the star power isn't what it used to be in RoH and honestly the roster is at it's thinnest in years. Sure we can always say that the roster will be supplemented with international stars. But again, you can't always count on those guys to become available so you have to really concentrate on the stateside players. Right now RoH as at it's highest point from a company stand point, but from a talent stand point at it's lowest. If they can manage to make retain Aries, make Strong and McGuinness true superstars and elevate some more guys on the roster then they'll be fine, but you know, I hate to say this and garner a lot of hate mail. It's not going to be all smooth sailing for RoH just because they got a PPV deal because NOW they have to worry about expanding their market without the comfort of already firmly established "big stars".
Michael Bauer: It's obviously going to affect Ring of Honor a ton, but I think that this should have been coming for a while now after several wrestlers have gotten suspended by TNA for sticking to their commitments and not putting the biggest company first. Yes the roster is thin, but what did they really lose? Sabin and Shelley part time, Homicide, and maybe Austin Aries. That's it. This is the perfect time to get new faces in the main event or at least upper midcard scene, something that should have been doing anyway.
Ari Berenstein: As I said above (and other have said previously), this move was inevitable. TNA would have pulled their talent out by the end of 2007 regardless of ROH's actions because they have their own agenda of expansion and more power to them for that. ROH is only going to be hurt by the short term loss of Aries (who many suspect will be back before long) and Homicide (who may one day yet return to ROH). Otherwise, ROH minimized the damage of losing TNA talent by slowly fading them out of storylines AND maximized their money draw in Samoa Joe by using the Fifth Year Festival as his farewell tour.
Jake Ziegler: I really don't think it will have any negative affect. TNA has done this before and ROH has lost so many big names and they still wind up always growing and always getting better. Aries, Cabana, Daniels, Joe, and Shingo being gone just means more time for the Briscoes, Evans, Jacobs, Delirious, Sydal, Whitmer, etc., so I am not worried in the least. ROH will continue to be the best wrestling company around.
Brad Garoon: When I tell my friends or my students about ROH its usually only after they hear the names Samoa Joe and Christopher Daniels that they get excited. Some of them, usually the more hardcore ones that bought the Highspots versions of the early ROH shows still perk up when they hear Danielson's name. It's in advertising that the loss of TNA talent hurts ROH, as name recognition is a plus. But through PPV that injury could be healed. If I were ROH I'd use this time to try to pick up a WWE castoff that isn't contracted by TNA right now to help with the name recognition problem. If Lance Storm were willing to work the ROH midcard on a semi-regular basis that would be a huge boost for ROH. Sean Waltman has been doing this in FIP, but I don't think he'd fit as well in ROH. If I were ROH I'd do whatever I could to get Storm, or in a perfect world Chris Jericho, to completely erase TNA's name from ROH fans' minds.
Samuel Berman: It will obviously have some impact, but the truth is that ROH has survived worse with a less cultivated roster. The original TNA talent pull that preceded the original Reborn shows left a far less experienced ROH roster behind. This time, ROH has established veterans like Danielson, McGuinness, Strong and the Briscoes, each of whom has been an established champion for the company and each of whom the audience buys in the main event. Add to them guys like Hero, Claudio, Delirious, Evans, Richards and Romero and you have the cream of the available Independent crop. The fans will miss the always-solid performances from Daniels and Homicide (and Aries if he ends up being unavoidably absent for a while), but with time will surely find that there are other great performers to work their way into those spots, like Matt Cross, El Generico and Kevin Steen to name but a few. Now if only we could get Ryan, Bosh & Lost in an ROH ring…
All things considered, will ROH's venture into Pay Per View be a successful one?
Stuart Carapola: I do. They already have their core fanbase who will buy anything with the ROH logo on it, and I think that with the low price, the PPV will be one of those things. So if you've already got your core fanbase or a good portion of it buying the show, then they're only going to attract more fans from people who are just flipping around looking for something to watch. If they impress those fans, they might come back for the next PPV and buy some DVDs before then. This will be a good thing for ROH.
Matt Adamson: I think so, because ROH knows that they can't expect to just jump in and be a player. They also know they have a loyal fanbase that already puts a lot of money into their product. The fact that they are actually a good product and at most times must-see shows that they have a good grasp on the quality aspect of the business. The PPV will be worth whatever we pay which I hear is $10. That'll be nothing to see some ROH.
Bayani Domingo: It all depends on what you consider "success". Let's say that you have international buys added into the figures, I would consider anything over 10,000 buys to be at least pretty successful for an "Indy Company". The chances for them to improve on that is definitely there though because they have a good international following. I think this is the right path for RoH and the timing isn't horrible, but remember they have to not only grow their PPV audience but prove the roster that is left is worth the money rather than just hearing about the show and buying the DVD for free. Oh yeah, did we forget that little thing called "pirating". One would hope RoH fans don't just tape the show and forgo the cost of buying the DVD later, because PPV $'s don't mean a thing if it digs too deeply into the DVD sales does it? Still I think RoH will do good numbers initially and if they decide to tour out west more and the Japanese tour goes well I could see them challenging TNA's meager numbers by early 2009.
Michael Bauer: You have to define success. For RoH, that 10,000 buys number from Bayani sounds about right. I mean, they have the tools to do it. They have international followings in the UK and Japan. They have guys like Sam and Ari who see the letters RoH and start drooling. They have a strong following in four of the biggest markets in the country (New York, Philly, Chicago, and Detroit) and that have a lot of experience in doing something that TNA and WWE don't do that well anymore… putting on a quality show from top to bottom. If they can continue to do that, there is no reason that they can not compete with TNA's mostly piss poor Pay Per Views.
Ari Berenstein: Gabe Sapolsky has said in many interviews the major goal of this endeavor is to get the name recognition out for the product. I think he is underselling this move a bit in order to help pad against potential low numbers of buys. I think that in order to be a success, ROH has to get the word out through advertising to wrestling fans. Ultimately though, if they pick up anymore fans than they had before, this is a winner. If ROH simply has its hardcore fans buying the product, well, it won't have done as desired, but at least they will pocket a little bit more profit.
Jake Ziegler: Absolutely. As I said earlier, no fans are going to turn away from ROH because of this, and they'll make plenty of new fans out of it just from the increased exposure. I know I'll be ordering the PPV, and I think there are plenty who are with me there.
Brad Garoon: As long as the current model is temporary and the goal is to get to a live PPV then yes, this will be a successful venture for the company. Four Pay Per Views a year (which is what I'm hearing the current plan is) is the right place to start. If ROH puts the Death Before Dishonors, Glory by Honors, Final Battles and anniversary shows on PPV then it will be few and far between enough that ROH fans and curious wrestling fans in general will buy. The important thing is to keep those cards special and to eventually drive for a live Pay Per View.
Samuel Berman: I think my colleagues have said it well: this move, with it's low risk and high reward, can do nothing but help expand ROH's fanbase. New fans will quickly discover what longtime fans have known all along: Ring of Honor is the best dollar-value wrestling company in the world.
