Shining a Spotlight 5.22.08: The Underrated

Posted by Michael Weyer on 05.22.2008

After causing a furor with the previous list, I flip over for my picks of the talents who aren't given as much credit as they deserve.

Wow, no idea the bomb I was dropping with last week's column. Yeah, expected comments but not over 150 of them. Course, at least a quarter were "you suck" stuff but hey, I do appreciate everyone who wrote, good and bad comments. I don't think I'll be getting quite as many with this one but maybe some comments all the same. Speaking of which, I know it's been a long time since I did a mailbag but since the comments thing was added, not as much of it. However, did get a couple of mails on the overrated column. First Matt Bowen had this to say on Hansen:

Hey, You seem very limited on your Puro knowledge. I will hook you up with almost any old AJPW/NJPW/others. Please watch it. It's sad to see you diss Stan Hansen and not understand his Greatness in the ring. He's been in two more ***** matches than Bryan by God Danielson.

Anyways, the links are
www.theditch.biz
www.theditch.us
www.theditch.com

PLEASE check these out, you will not regret it. His Japanese work was incredible.

Matt also sent a LONG list of about forty five-star puro bouts. Wow, that's a damn good list. We ever revive the Puro Report, you'd be a good guy for it. Look, not saying Hansen wasn't good, just never got the whole "legend" aspect to him. Maybe I'm just not the right guy to get into it but still feel that he just wasn't as awesome as he gets so much credit for but that's my view.


Also, a nice detailed letter from Chris Coady:

Aloha

As a former columnist (ask Tremendous Tom Lawrence for details), I appreciate your efforts and time put into your work. I have read many of your columns and I was fairly certain that you were a young man (I asked the great TTL, aka Csonka, for verification) by leanings of your opinions and viewpoints. There is nothing wrong with being young, I still with I was (I am 40). However there are some subjects that need to be treated differently than other subjects when commenting on them. One of those is "overrated" wrestlers.

Although we have access to old videos/DVDs/and WWE 24/7, it really doesn't do a lot of good in conveying the replays that are shown from the past to now. People like Rick Rude aren't nearly as rude, Honky Tonk Man even looks more lame and Brutus Beefcake is the ultimate cartoon. The matches are full of slow pacing, anything that involved a "foreign object" always left more damage then than now, and frankly the production wasn't very good. A lot has changed from my generation to your generation in wrestling entertainment. High spots that happen now were unthinkable when I was your age, especially when bigger athletes performing many of them. The production is top notch and the girls look a lot better.

I say this because I really was disappointed in your column this week. I understand the draw to comment on the overrated but most of the people you picked our far outside of your generation or at least your most impactful viewing pleasure. I'll humor you a bit with each one of your picks and my comments:

Rob Van Dam: Ask Geoff Eubanks, who contributes to Larry's SD 4Rs frequently about my feelings on RVD if you want the full story of my loathing of him. However your comments really didn't ring as a overrated for RVD but a defense of Cena in the process. It is really tough to rate ECW when you had no feel for what ECW represented at the time. ECW was viewed by the resthold masses as a second rate company, whose second-rate workers were performing at a Bingo Hall and not usually getting paid on a regular basis by Paul E. Dangerously! The reality at the time is that it was full of first rate castoff workers and indy guys who never were going to be more than jobbers in a real federation anyway. RVD was one of those workers, so was Mikey Whipwreck, The Pitbulls, Sandman, Taz, Tommy Dreamer, Steven Richards, so he wasn't alone. You add Scotty Flamingo and Shane Douglas, and now you have credibility from the B-list talent being injected.

Given all of those things, none of these guys were overrated for ECW at that moment. RVD was very revelant and he was a flagbearer for a federation much like Tito Santana was for the WWF. RVD didn't need the big shiny belt to be considered one of the best in that federation. His quirkness, both as a worker and a character was a pure definition of ECW. It was renegade, it was individual driven and it was come as you are. The ECW on video we get to see today isn't real reflective of the statement that the organization was driving home at the time. The fact that RVD was so over in ECW that he got a payday/push in WWE far too late in his career to matter shouldn't be held against him, it should be viewed as a testimony to his success early in his career when he was lucky to get meal money.

Bruiser Brody: Here is someone that you never should have commented on because you never watched him work when you didn't know the result. Brody is one of the models for tall thick brawlers today. Brody, Crusher, Kiniski and Dick Murdoch really understood how to be a big brawler and make the faces better in the process. Brody moved from territory to territory because of many factors, but it is a testament to his career that promoters wanted him in the area for a bit to prop up there upper division and give them more cred, even though they all knew Brody was an ass to work with.

Shane Douglas: A lot of the stuff said for RVD/ECW applies to Shane. Shane never quite had it for a big time fed. He never really was himself and he usually was compared to this wrestler or that wrestler. Shane just wasn't going to be his own man in those feds and you are right, he didn't seem natural in WCW/NWA or WWF. In ECW though, he was allowed to be the total prick/jerk that he really was deep inside. Heyman somehow allowed this to shine even though it was a volatile stick of dynamite in the process. Thanks to Douglas, ECW had a credible high B-list star they needed to maximize the potential of the unknowns on their roster who became stars thanks to working meaningful matches with Douglas.

The Rock N Roll Express: Do you want Larry to fire ya? As a huge Midnight's fan, I really hated RnR. as a huge LOD fan, I wanted Hawk/Animal to snap RnR in pieces. But you had to really be part of that era of wrestling to appreciate how great tag team wrestling was at the time in the NWA and UWF. RnR didn't have it all. They weren't fast, strong or full of charisma. However they connected as every man's tag team and capitalized on the bandanas long before it was a 80s benchmark. I think your generation would have a hard time looking back at most tag teams from my generation with much words of encouragement though.

David Von Erich: You correctly imply that all wrestlers are better dead than alive. If I was you in this situation, I would have singled out Owen Hart (or Bret or Stu), a man that never won a major belt that was always overshadowed by his brother so much that Owen was still donning a Blue costume in his 30s just to attempt to define himself outside of his brother's shadow. Owen dies doing something that he shouldn't be doing (an event I witness) and he is suddenly the greatest wrestler of all time for that month.

I rant - sorry. David's potential will never be known but most people don't even give him a thought. The man was dead before you were born and his tapes are mostly the orient where he was working with people who made him look like Dan Spivey. David is better dead than alive, especially when the Flair/Race wrestling godhead surrendered the belt to him.

Batista: A guy you are eligible to comment on because you have watched it unfold. I totally agree with your opinions of this guy.

Michael Hayes: Chris Jericho mimicks Michael Hayes more so than any of the other people he gimmicks. It is really hard to understand the redneck south of the 70s and 80s when you weren't around to experience it. Hayes had a lot of the same kind of love/hate that Flair did at the time. Bret Michaels of Poison is a good comparison to Michael Hayes. He isn't overly gifted, he isn't overly manly, he isn't overly charming but somehow it works. A lot like Billy Bob Thorton.

Andre the Giant: Shaking my head at this one. Andre could never be booked for the big shiny belt because who would beat him for it when he was in his prime? Those who lived the moment knew it, so we just accepted it for what it was. Since you didn't live it, all you see is unneccessary matches on the card just to watch a sideshow attraction.

Ken Kennedy: You are qualified to write about him, for sure. It is a hard thing for a person to finally get the spot on the upper card though. He might the next HHH (who took forever getting to the upper card) or the next Boris whatever his name was.

Scott Steiner: Wow! The Steiner brothers I watched getting mixed into a STACKED NWA roster in the late 80s and early 90s, were really something to behold. Rick Steiner was this fireplug of a man who gave unintellible interviews to fit his character. Scott was eventually paired with him as the mouthpiece, so the audience wouldn't have to suffer through Rick forgetting his lines during Tony Schiavone softball questions. Scott Steiner was the first big man I remember executing moves that are standards today. Eventually they grew to one of the greatest tag teams of all time and then Scott was injured again. Scott resurfaces in a defined roided state and reinvents his character in the process. I hated the character and still do but he couldn't stay in those colorful Cheer advertisement ring attires forever. He wasn't that same wrestler anymore and he redefined himself with very little resistance in a LOADED WCW at the time. I really don't know what more you want out of a worker?

Rhino: Another guy you are fully qualified to comment on. He just tries really hard to continue to try really hard.

Larry Zybsko: One victory or feud sometimes defines and makes the whole career. Ultimate Warrior is defined by Hulk Hogan. Tully Blanchard is forever linked with Magnum TA and Larry Z turned on Bruno to rock the world in the 70s. The fact that he was allowed to ride this heel turn for 30 years is lost on me but it is really hard for you to comment on. You weren't a part of the fanfabric at the time and his turn was "cowardly" which was a great word for those times. You just didn't see that many face/heel turns in this period, so it is one of the forever turns in history of Pro Wrestling. The Russo years have killed the face/heel concept and turns, especially looking backwards in time.

Stan Hansen: Hard to defend Stan's blindness or stupidity in the ring. He was a trainwreck to work with but...you weren't even alive during his glory years. Stan Hansen might be the only man that made me want Nick Bockwinkle to beat him and I hated that slow motion Bockwinkle! I guess Stan was effective, eh?

To conclude, I realize that I might have been overly harsh but that comes from the passion I have from what I viewed firsthand. I think that makes a big difference when evaluating anything. Sure we have reruns of various shows and even networks dedicated to them but you really don't get the feel of the show in its place of time because the culture was different. I can't stand I Love Lucy but I didn't live in that era, so I am probably missing a little something about that show that would allow me to have enjoyed it better.

As we both know, a little of this and a little of that makes wrestling better or worse. Patriotic gimmicks I grew up with don't work today. Jeff Hardy wouldn't work well in my generation, either. However both have value for their time. Try to focus on the events that are in your time, your viewing pleasure or displeasure. You have more than enough to comment in depth on in your time, leave those old faces and places to guys like me, Hyatte, Zimmerman, Csonka and Meltzer, who clearly are blinded by the Rock n Roll era of wrestling.

Love live Captain Lou,

TheGunisGood

I never considered the question of not being able to comment on guys when I wasn't part of their fan base at the time. I do acknowledge I'm a more "modern" wrestling fan, do often see stuff from the 1970's as slower and a bit dull but that happens. I mean, lots of newer fans say the Ramon/Michaels Wrestlemania X ladder match is dull as hell but don't understand how much it changed the landscape of the business at the time. However, I do stick by my choices a lot. I heard a lot of guys talking about Owen being rated much higher than he deserved (Scott Keith takes it to a frankly ridiculous level) and agree with the "dead gets you better ranking" theory (well, except for Benoit) which is something else to think about. I don't think you came off too harsh, I heard a lot worse among the comments and do agree it may be a generational thing but still hold to my choices nonetheless. But thanks for such a detailed reply.


"Underrated" doesn't get as much debate as "overrated" but I do think people have their picks for them all the same. They're guys who have so much ability and even potential and many of whom have achieved great success but never quite get the due owed them. Now, as with the previous list, I am cutting some name here and there. For example, I've long been in the camp of Cena being rather underrated in terms of ring ability and such (before the haters get in on me, just think about stuff like him being a great seller and the fact he almost never looks blown up in long matches). I know some guys may seem famous but also get a lot of hate thrown at them, not all of which is deserved. As with my previous list, these are my own picks, I'm sure others will disagree and have their own so feel free to comment. So my picks…


Lex Luger: A lot of the hate for Luger is for his personal life in the last few years. Yes, a lot is also for his style in the ring as he could come off stiff at times. However, if you take the time to watch some of his early stuff from 1987-91, the guy really wasn't that bad. True, he was often carried but still had better than many credit him for now. Luger's problem was never quite potential, he had it. The problem was that he was rushed way too fast by Florida promoters who were too eager to make him the next Hogan and not give him time to develop his skills. So he was not only raw but also got a swelled had fast as he was given a title only a month into his career. I know people will say he only fit in with the Horsemen because the rest covered for him but it takes more than three great guys to look good (Paul Roma proves that). Luger did have a good drive and was really over with the fans. Yes, his run as champ in 1991 was poor but let's face it, WCW had more than enough problems then that you can't blame it all on him. I do think his accident in '92 cut a lot of his ring skills down although he still managed to do well in WCW for many years afterward. Yeah, the guy got into a lot of stuff in the last few years (not going so far as to say Elizabeth's death was his fault of course) but I don't think it quite fair to lambaste him as a worse guy than he was in the ring. Maybe not great but then neither was Hogan himself.


Demolition: How is it possible to hold the record as the longest-reigning tag team champions ever and be ignored by most "greatest tag team" lists? Well, in the case of Ax and Smash, it's obviously due to their act. Barry Darsow can talk all he wants on how Demolition were never intended to be Road Warrior rip-offs but come on, we all know they were. It's not like they were the only ones to be sure; they were just the most successful. The thing is, you can make a case that Demolition were actually better in the ring than the Warriors. Yeah, not the same power and overall presence but much better sellers and technicians who reigned long as both heels and faces at a time when WWF's tag team scene was at a high. The two had great chemistry that had fans backing them and proved they earned that long reign and its follow-ups. Yeah, adding Crush was rough but it did give the team a bit more life afterward and the fact we never saw them against each other has helped add to their rep as a great team. While the Warriors at the end were a shadow of their once great self, Demolition broke up before they got too stale and thus keep their great tough rep. It's a shame most don't recall that more.


Shelton Benjamin: I think I may get some agreement here. Now, it's true Shelton does have some problems on the mic, not quite comfortable with it at times and a bit rough too. He also hasn't quite found the right in-ring character and this "Butch Reed 2.0" thing isn't quite right for him. Which is a damn shame because the guy should have been a bigger star at this point. He is incredibly talented technically and with high-flying moves and proved he can do big stuff with the first two MITB matches. He's also shown he can handle himself against big names like HHH and Shawn Michaels and three reigns as IC champ and two as tag champ are nothing to sneeze at. If he could just find the right character and persona, he may be able to finally click over and get higher up which he deserves. Of course, with some guys, too much character can be a bad thing…


Marc Mero: It's a damn shame that Mero's major claim to fame is Johnny B. Badd. Fact was, in his prime, the guy was a damn good worker, good technical prowess, nice selling and a pair of hard hitting fists. Unfortunately, WCW's brilliant idea to package him as a Little Richard look-alike who would put plastic lips on fallen opponents that he never quite got rid of, despite winning two TV titles. He did slightly better in WWF as himself, winning the IC belt before a knee injury curtailed his run. When he did come back, he had a tough new attitude but seemed a bit lost and his big contribution was introducing then-wife Rena aka Sable. He popped up briefly as Badd in TNA but is pretty much out of the game and again, it's a shame he has to be remembered more for his goofball character antics rather than a good ring guy who took to it well.


Rick Martel: Winning a world title when you're young is not always a good thing. When Martel became AWA champion, it was pretty much a move of desperation on Verne Gagne's part, his attempt to get his own fresh babyface to win fans over. Unfortunately, at the time, Martel was just too bland on interviews to really carry although he was a good worker. After losing the belt, he'd bounce around, winning the WWF tag titles with Tito Santana before becoming heel. The "Model" may have been a goofy character but Martel was great with it, constantly flashing his arrogance, milking the heat of the crowd for himself and seeming to improve in the ring as he went. While he never did get a big title run, he had good feuds with guys from Jake Roberts to Razor Ramon and still had good skills during it all. Maybe he wasn't right for his world title run then but he did prove a worthy competitor afterward.


Elix Skipper: It says a lot that the guy responsible for one of the greatest moments in TNA history can be forgotten by his own company so fast. To this day, TNA will run the bit from "Turning Point ‘04" with Skipper's incredible cage-walk/hurricarana which was amazing to watch. He did get a push afterward as a singles face but never quite a big player as most expected. A shame as he is still capable of some high-flying moves and good technical skills but got mired in the tag ranks too long with Simon Diamond and then the XXX reunion. Is he even still under TNA contract? It's been so long since he's been seen, it's hard to tell. But if you can dig up some of the older TNA DVD's, you can see Skipper as one of the X Division players who never got to get the belt, rather unfair but then, we know how TNA can be with talent.


Dustin Rhodes: In terms of actual athleticism and wrestling ability, I do believe Dustin is one of the few cases of the son being superior to the father. He was definitely in better shape and while his early push in WCW was due to his dad's backstage power, Dustin did show a good ability with nice technical skills Dusty lacked, some power hitting and his blandness was soon pushed aside for good rapport with the fans. He had good reigns as tag champion with Ricky Steamboat and Barry Windham and some decent singles runs too. But more importantly, Dustin showed a knowledge that being under his father's large shadow (no fat jokes please) was holding him back and so conceived Goldust, which has to rank as one of those ideas truly ahead of its time. Yeah, it was out there for 1995 but considering the ways the boundaries were pushed and shattered in the next few years, Dustin was onto something. It was a bit freaky with the homosexual overtones but he still backed it up with good ring action and his act added to his heat. Of course, he soon was trapped by it as it was really the only way he could be successful on his own as proven by his poor WCW and TNA runs afterward. Black Reign is obviously his attempt to capture that magic again and it's a bit disturbing that he only feels comfortable in a goofy persona as he is a good worker overshadowed by a father whose ring skills he outshines.


The Fantastics: One of the most overlooked tag teams ever, Bobby Fulton and Tommy Rogers were doing high-flying and hard brawling battles before Shawn Michaels and Marty Jannetty ever met. The two blended together perfectly in the ring with hot tags, double-teams and great high-flying attacks. But they also proved they could get down and dirty as with their bloody 1986 feud with the Sheepherders. They did have a good run in the NWA feuding with the Midnight Express for the US tag titles that showed the best of both teams but somehow fell under the cracks afterward which doesn't seem right for a pairing capable of so much. Indeed, most fans barely know they existed but if you watch a classic match of them showing old-school tag team at its finest, you wonder how anyone could forget.


Davey Boy Smith: I know I may hear it from some on this one. Davey Boy has often been cited as a guy who had to be carried to decent bouts and being a bit rough in the ring. But track down some of his classic Stampede stuff and a trimmer Davey Boy was good then. The British Bulldogs in their prime were a classic team, Davey Boy the power, Dynamite Kid the speed and their long success shows Davey Boy wasn't just some hanger-on. His singles stuff is also better than he gets credit for as he was a great technician (as natural for someone trained in the Dungeon) and if you watch the SummerSlam '92 match with Bret, you can see it's not a case of Bret carrying it all, Davey Boy gives well too. Yeah, he wasn't in Bret or even Owen's league as a singles guy but he was still good as his battle with Bret in December of '95 shows. Again, a shame his personal life gets more attention as well as the injuries that cut down his mobility. But watch his early stuff and you can see the Bulldog had more bite than people credit him for.


The Big Show: Again, a choice that may get some protests. Now, while being introduced as "the son of Andre" when he broke out in 1995 was bad, Paul Wight did do well. He was much trimmer then and it wasn't uncommon for him to throw dropkicks, unheard of for someone of his size. True, he had mostly power and chop moves but he also had smarter ring presence and a better seller than most big men. For his run since joining WWF, he's often shot down because of the goofier antics and angles he does but the guy has a great ring presence and charisma. I still remember the bit in 2000 where he would impersonate people in the ring (his Hogan imitation at Backlash is still utterly hysterical) and even today, he is able to get fans going for him, heel or face. He's slowed by injuries but still retains a great power presence and is still a better seller than most other big men you can name. More importantly, he's shown the ability to go along with whatever's asked of him and with so many guys getting in trouble, it's nice to see someone able to buck up and take what comes his way and often doing a fair job with it.


Candice Michelle: I admit a bit of bias as I've been a fan of hers since before she really started wrestling. Yeah, the body is stunning, we all loved the Playboy spread but Candice has also improved very nicely in the ring. Sure, she's no Trish Stratus but she's come quite far with some good moves (that leglock by the ropes is unique, give her that) and more importantly, really seems to have gotten into the actual wrestling instead of just posing about. She's taken a few lumps which shows she's really into the mat work and does seem to want to make a name as an in-ring competitor more than the usual Divas. I expect her to come back with a new fire and wanting to improve more, showing that even among the Divas, there's potential for real breakout talent, which is good for the future of women's wrestling.


So those are my picks, sure there will be a bit of debate about them, feel free to comment.


Also around 411mania:

Whacky Wrestling Theory outdoes itself with the concept of a 3-sided ring.

The Fink continues its imagined WWE vs TNA program.

Wrestling Bard roasts Bret Hart and gets roasted by fans in return.

Evolution Schematic continues its seemingly never-ending look at WWE video games.

Mike Chin looks at the Importance of I Quit matches.

Julian Bond asks us not to hate HHH.

The Shimmy continues its history of the WWE World Championship.

Ryan Merholz asks if Judgment Day was Worth Your Wealth.

Wrestling Doctor tries to build a better monster.

Piledriver Report calls for a tournament to decide wrestling's greatest rivalry.

Seventh Dimension looks at wrestlers turning to music.

Brooklyn Brawling reimagines the Invasion.

Tim does his Take on Smackdown.

Don't forget Column of Honor, Triple Threat, 3 R's, Fact or Fiction, Scripted Through Sin, Ask 411 and all the rest.


Next week, I continue this unplanned series by moving from wresters to over/underrated matches. For now the spotlight is off.