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Thoughts From The Top Rope 8.13.08: Life After the Legends
Posted by Daniel Wilcox on 08.13.2008



Welcome to another edition of Thoughts From The Top Rope, finally, after three weeks, fantasy booking-free. Not that I didn't enjoy that stuff, or the plethora of compliments regarding it, but it's nice to be back to the normal stuff again.

Before we get to the main point of the column, let's talk Summerslam!
  • People seem to be dismissive of Shawn Michaels' role at Summerslam, and while I don't think he's announcing any retirement, I do expect Chris Jericho to make an appearance and for it to result in some great promo work, so as far as I'm concerned, it's another reason to buy the show.
  • Khali vs. The Game could be horrific, or it could be a fun little match up. While I am dreading the three-minute nerve pinch resthold, I am kind of looking forward to the match.
  • Creative sucks for dropping the Burchills vs. Mickie/Kofi feud to put Santino and Beth on the card. Why not do a triple threat tag match involving all three mixed teams?
  • Cena vs. Batista should not be happening at a pay-per-view not named WrestleMania, but I'll be damned if I won't be on the edge of my seat anyway. I'm hoping for a Cena win, followed by Batista refusing a handshake and turning heel with a thunderous Batista Bomb.
  • CM Punk's promo on Monday night single-handedly managed to get me interested in he vs. JBL for the title, and maybe there's hope that Punk's title run won't be such a flop after all.
  • I'd be very surprised if Jeff Hardy and MVP didn't manage to top their Judgment Day match. I have high hopes for this one.
  • Does anyone think Edge stands a chance in Hell in a Cell?
  • It should still be an awesome match though.
  • Do you have any idea how unbearable Small will be if Khali wins the WWE Championship? Good job I don't read his news report anyway.
  • How is it that Santino Marella (awesome though he is) gets on the card, but the likes of Miz and Morrison, Kane, Chris Jericho, Shelton Benjamin, Umaga and Big Show miss out. Consider me baffled.
  • I was just kidding, Small.
  • Maybe.

I shouldn't think that there are too many people reading this article who were fans of professional wrestling before the debut of The Undertaker at Survivor Series 1990, and even less have followed "the biz" since Shawn Michaels broke into it during the mid-eighties.

Shawn Michaels and The Undertaker are two men who have done everything there is to do in the business, and through the highs and the lows, each of them have become legends, and not just because they've been around for as long as they have. Few men have had as many top quality matches as Shawn Michaels has. His career spans nearly twenty-four years and has seen him battle with all the top names to have come and go since then; Ric Flair, Hulk Hogan, Bret Hart, Steve Austin, Triple H, Kurt Angle, John Cena and more. Likewise, Taker has feuded with all of these legends and more, and also began his career in 1984 – twenty-four years ago.

On the surface, Undertaker and Michaels are two completely different characters. Taker is the dominant Deadman whose legacy lies in his gimmick and the fact that he has been able to sustain the character for so long. I don't think anyone would deny that The Undertaker is the most successful gimmick in the history of professional wrestling. Shawn Michaels, on the other hand, is a comparatively small performer whose biggest asset is his hear and courage, and ability to out-perform anybody on any given night. He is, after all, the showstopper. But really, they're the exact same kind of performer – one who goes out to the ring not just to have a match, but to put on a show – and I'll go on record as saying no one has ever done that better than Shawn Michaels and The Undertaker.

But the similarities don't end there. Both men were born in 1965, both men were raised in the state of Texas, both men were key figures in ushering the Attitude Era and both men are shoe-ins for the Hall of Fame. Both men appeared on the very first episode of Monday Night Raw (the only two performers still with the company to do so), and both men have a legitimate claim as being the MVP of WrestleMania. Both men are multi-time world champions but are not best known for their title success. More importantly in regards to the whole point of this column, both men have been plagued by injuries in recent years and at forty-three years of age, in all likelihood, both men only have a few more years, if that, before it's time to leave the ring for good.

Rewind about eighteen months, to the 2007 Royal Rumble. With Triple H out injured and both John Cena and Batista being world champions at the time, the two biggest names in the match were Michaels and Taker, and they were also the two favourites. But no one envisioned the conclusion to the match that we got. Michaels and Taker were the final two men in the match, and they went a good 7-8 minutes, producing some of the most exciting, enthralling and dramatic viewing the wrestling world has seen. Needless to say, it not only proved that these two old-timers still had it, whatever "it" is, but it whetted the appetite of millions of fans around the world who all of a sudden wanted to see Shawn Michaels and The Undertaker go at it one more time.


Shawn Michaels and Undertaker made Royal Rumble history in 2007

Of course, this was not the first time Undertaker and Michaels had met in a high-profile environment. Ten years earlier, Michaels and Taker feuded for several months before they finally met inside the first ever Hell in a Cell match. Eleven years later and Undertaker is preparing to enter Hell again at Summerslam, while on the same night Shawn Michaels will reveal what his future entails after suffering a potentially career-ending injury at the hands of Chris Jericho.

Undertaker is no stranger to Hell in a Cell, having participated in the match more times than any one else and it being one of his many speciality matches. That brings up the point that more or less every rivalry that Taker has been involved him has followed the same pattern of a younger guy wanting to take out Taker, and eventually doing so, only for Taker to return a couple of months later to exact his revenge in one of his speciality matches, be it Hell in a Cell, a Casket match, a Last Ride match or any number of others. Most recently, we've seen it with Edge, but over the last few years they've gone the exact same route with the likes of Mr. Kennedy, Randy Orton, Kane, Heidenreich and Mark Henry. And while it's a proven formula, few would deny that the act is pretty stale in 2008. Similarly, Shawn Michaels is not taking time off for his first kayfabe injury. The Heartbreak Kid has made more comebacks from injury then I care to remember or indeed write down, but on most occasions, he returns and exacts his revenge on those cocky, young upstarts.

The common denominator is that both men excel in these kinds of angles and more often than not they put on fantastic performances that help put their opponents over even if said opponents don't score the one-two-three on either legend.

And that's another complaint that many people have about Michaels and Taker: that they don't put enough people over. I am here to tell you now that that theory is complete bullshit, because simply by being involved in a rivalry with either of these two legends any young performer is automatically elevated in the eyes of the fans. If the feuds were completely one-sided, you may have an argument, but they're not. If the matches were really bad, you may have a point, but they aren't. Taker and Michaels' popularity ensures that their opponents get over as heels and that's a wave that a talented performer can ride for a long time.


Shawn Michaels makes one of his many returns in October 2007

But even if you do think that the angles both men are involved in are tired retreads, and even you do think neither likes to put younger talent over, and even if you hold a grudge against Michaels for Montreal, one could never present a valid argument as to why the wrestling world would be a better place without Michaels and Taker. And while I don't think anyone really believes that Shawn will retire at Summerslam, it does make you think about what life after HBK would be like. Undertaker may be returning from his hiatus this Sunday, but it's worth thinking about, what happens when he finally does hang up his long coat and hat?

As I mentioned, some people have their grudges with both Michaels and Taker, but generally, both are accepted in the wrestling world for the icons that they are and I think we can all appreciate what each has done for this business that we are all fans of. This mentality is the exact opposite of most people's opinion of the only man really ready to step into the role of "legend-who-can-still-deliver" once Taker and Michaels are gone. The man I am talking about is of course Triple H.

Any regular readers of mine will know that I am by no means one of those pesky little HHHaters. On the contrary, the guy was one of my favourites when I first started watching wrestling and I still have a ton of respect for the guy today, but even I am willing to admit that he is not quite on the level of Shawn Michaels or Undertaker, in regards to either his status as a legend or what he is capable of doing in the ring these days, or indeed in a few years time. Of course, it may be a moot point because despite his love for performing, when Triple H reaches the stage of his career that Shawn and Taker are currently, I can't imagine him wanting to put his body through the rigors of wrestling on a regular basis when he has the advantages that he does.

The point is, once Shawn and Taker are gone, there really is no legend left to fill the void who is universally accepted by the wrestling fan base. And while there are four guys who are well on their way to legendary status, those four guys make up the core of today's product and as such can't really be looked in the same why that the Heartbreak Kid or the Phenom can be. If you're wondering, the four men I am referring to are John Cena, Edge, Batista and Randy Orton.

There is, however, one guy who I think would nicely be able to fill the role of Shawn Michaels in a couple of years time; the kind of guy that has had title runs but steps aside for the younger talent to take over but at the same time, puts on some of the best matches year in year out. The only problem with this theory, the guy I'm thinking of is the main focus of TNA, Kurt Angle. If Angle ever did come back to WWE though, he'd only add to his legacy by filling the role of miracle-worker, getting good matches out of unlikely performers and stealing the show whenever he feels like it.

As far as replacement for The Undertaker, I don't think it will ever happen, simply because his character is so unique and in this day and age, it is nearly impossible to sustain such a gimmick for so long. Although thinking about it, there was that rumour that Boogeyman was lined up to be the next Taker. I'm sure that will work out great.

Maybe I am over-thinking this, but to me it seems as though Michaels and Taker are pretty much irreplaceable, and that is obviously a testament to just how good each of them are.

With all of that in mind, I think it's worth relishing in the fact that both men are still around and some might argue, still at their best. Shawn Michaels's feuds with Ric, Jericho and Batista this year have been nothing short of incredible and Shawn has more than held up his end, cutting great promos and wrestling fantastic matches with each and every one of them. Similarly, Undertaker's series of matches with Edge this year have been top notch, and I expect the pair of them to enter Hell in a Cell Sunday and deliver yet again. Thinking about each of their current feuds though, I think it's safe to say that Chris Jericho and Edge have outshone Michaels and Taker respectively, carrying the bulk of the feud when their legendary foes haven't been there and cutting some of the best promos a wrestling audience has seen in a long time. Perhaps this is a sign of things to come as the old guard begins to step away from the limelight in preparation for the inevitable that is their retirement.

To answer the question "what will life in pro wrestling be like after Michaels and Taker?", I think that it will be very different, but at the same time, exactly the same. Because wrestling, like life, evolves and eventually we all move on. Sometimes, we do so begrudgingly. But in the grand scheme of things, something that we perceive as better at the time will eventually come along and at some moment in time, we'll momentarily forget about the likes of Shawn Michaels and The Undertaker. But that's what legacies are for, and few have legacies as impressive as those two.

Essential Reading

As always, there's a plethora of great articles floating around 411. Here's just a few.
Once you get through that lot, be sure to be on the look out for my ECW Palace Perspective.

That's all for another edition of Thoughts From The Top Rope. Here's hoping you enjoyed the ride, and if you didn't, I'll try harder next week.


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Comments (28)

 
Watching wrestling without Taker and Michaels will be just like watching wrestling without Stone Cold Steve Austin, lame and unwatchable.

Posted By: MBD (Guest)  on August 12, 2008 at 11:52 PM

 
 
HBK and Taker are both one-of-a-kind legends. They are part of the dying breed of old school headliners along with HHH. Angle will never return to WWE and WWE would never take him back anyway. I don't think Angle will ever be as good he was when he was in WWE. I'm surprised the guy is still able to even compete. And I think Michaels should retire. His eye(s) is all messed up and he can barely walk.

Posted By: dude11767 (Registered)  on August 12, 2008 at 11:56 PM

 
 
That was the first I'd seen the ending to that Rumble, many thanks! I really hope we get HBK/Taker at WrestleMania, in a "Who is the true Mania MVP?" match. It is in Texas this year and a fued between the hasn't been done since Michaels was damn near crippled way back in '98. It will be a sad day in the WWE when they're gone, as they are truly the best workers Vince has at his disposal right now. Don't get me wrong there are still guys who can deliver, but nobody does it like those two. I also don't think HHH will be around much longer than them, and Big Dave won't be far behind. One more knee injury for Hunter and he's done for. You'd think he'd start using a different finisher by now. Batista's is/damn near is 40, so how much longer will he be able to hold up despite his young career.

Posted By: sefdog (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 12:41 AM

 
 
Hi Daniel,

Enjoyed the article! So as a return benifit(ha!) to you, it is "shoo in" and not shoe-in. It is analogous to shooing in chicken into the coop. so never make the same mistake again. :)


Posted By: j (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 03:18 AM

 
 
Thinking of people in WWE who'd become the legends to put people over after Undertaker and Michaels are gone, how about Chris Jericho?

Posted By: Rob (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 07:24 AM

 
 
"Thinking of people in WWE who'd become the legends to put people over after Undertaker and Michaels are gone, how about Chris Jericho?"

Jericho's been putting people over for years and no doubt will continue to do so. But I agree, he is a bona fide legend, and in my opinion, probably th best all rounder the WWE has now, better even than Shawn and Taker. He beats both on promos and beats Taker on ability, and is damn near equal with Shawn on ability.

I can actually see Angle going back to WWE in a couple of years or so. If his injuries heal sufficiently to be able to maintain a part time schedule with TNA, then I dont see why he cant have the same schedule with WWE. A face Angle returning to feud with a heel CM Punk would be awesome to watch.


Posted By: Pure Dynamite (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 08:30 AM

 
 
I heard Micheals used to like getting buttf*cked. Maybe it's true, maybe not. It's no uncommon for gays and bis to get married and dive head first into religion in order to lessen the guilt and shame they feel. If he is gay, then I hope UT gets him in the HIC one more time and sends that pretty boy homo to Rest In Peace.

Posted By: Paul Bear (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 09:17 AM

 
 
shawn michaels left for 4 years way back when, and we all survived just fine. wrestling lived on. the undertaker has been "suspended" and "injured" so many times these past few years that it's almost like he *is* gone, and we all have been surviving just fine. wrestling lived on. i guess what i am trying to say is wrestling does not die when one of its legends retires. if it did, then wrestling wouldn't have survived with the leaving of sammartino, muraco, steamboat, jake roberts, bret hart, the rock, hogan, piper, andre, austin, billy graham, savage, foley, funk, buddy rogers, rhodes, race, etc, etc, etc. it's still alive and thriving. so why should it be any different with michaels & taker?

Posted By: Double C (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 09:34 AM

 
 
I really hope we get HBK/Taker at WrestleMania, in a "Who is the true Mania MVP?" match.A feud between them hasn't been done since Michaels was damn near crippled way back in '98.

Posted By: sefdog (Guest) on August 13, 2008 at 12:41 AM

WOW, I mean WOW WOW WOW. First of all, Undertaker is 16-0, The Fart Break Wind is 5-9. That ends that argument. Secondly Michaels was nowhere near crippled. He needed the 4 1/2 yrs off to recover from some injuries but even that is suspect after all he's gone thru since.


Posted By: Darren (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 09:37 AM

 
 
Great job! Really good read. I agree with a lot of what u said. Wrestling will be extremely weird without Taker & HBK! Like u said time will go on & people will move on but for a while it won't be the same!

Again, Great job! Keep it up!

PEACE!


Posted By: THE BOMB! (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 09:48 AM

 
 
I think that bother Edge and Jericho will go down as legends and they both have great ability.

One thing i'd love to see Jericho do is wrestle a match as Shawn Michaels. Do all of Michaels spots as I think Jericho is the equal of Michaels in ability it's just that Michaels is always booked as being resilient and can he do it while Jericho's ability isnt ever really questioned.


Posted By: DaveJuk (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 10:20 AM

 
 
Damn it!, now I want Angle to come back to WWE. Imagine he has the same intro movie as TNA, but he says, "I'm Baaack" that would be sweet.

Posted By: Adam (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 10:30 AM

 
 
b4 taker goes i would like 2 see another ministry of darkness era the WWE brings back big daddy v (make him wear a shirt) work back the acoylytes and get hawkins and ryder to be the new brood

Posted By: robert (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 10:42 AM

 
 
the last remaining legends in US wrestling are sting, angle, hbk and taker.
after those four are gone, the next in line are HHH, jericho, and maybe edge.


Posted By: rey (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 10:47 AM

 
 
Next Wrestlemania.

Shawn Michaels vs The Undertaker

Streak vs Career

If Shawn loses he retires.


Posted By: Triple J (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 11:15 AM

 
 
Both these guys are way past their prime and were never that good to begin with. Taker sucks in the ring. Michaels has had a horrible character dating back to the Rockers gimmick. Wrestling will be better off without these two who refuse to put young talent over.

Posted By: bk (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 12:29 PM

 
 
When HBK was left, the WWF had it's most successful period of all time. He came back when that was just over........Wrestling survives without him.

Taker could Semi-Retire and come back a few times a year to put people over/for the nostalgia a la Hogan only not going over Young Talent (no,Sheep, Hogan WAS the rite man to win against HBKin '05)


Posted By: Stealer (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 01:51 PM

 
 
Well great article the thing is yes wrestling would move on but will never be the same.I mean even I watch wrestling just to know about HBK and if he is not in I dnt feel much like watching. Well undertaker is great on his own terms but still HBK would be a bigger loss to e because you like him or not there is no one else who could give us a 5 star match like he does. Well unless someone really gets intresting, I dont think I might be a serious wrestling fan after HBK's gone. Well anywas lets enjoy the best of both of them as long as they are there

Posted By: nash (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 04:40 PM

 
 
I thought Taker's debut was at Survivor Series 1990, not 1984!

Posted By: Chris (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 06:46 PM

 
 
My worry is that with Mania 25 taking place in the same place as Mania 17 and Triple H now being on Smackdown, I would HATE to see a Triple H vs Taker rematch. You know, deep down in that HUGE ego, that Trips HATES having a loss to Taker on the big stage and nothing would boost his ego even more as to have "ended takers streak" on his cv. He can then end Shawns career at a later date and have "beat the man who ended Ric Flairs career" on it too. Plus his eventual 20 World/WWE titles Trips wont stop until he had basically bought his way into the top honours. He's good, no doubt, but he is NO Undertaker and he is NO HBK. There is never the emotional connection in his matches. You only have to look at his match with Edge. As soon as the match started and Trips started dominating the crowd DIED. Look at all his matches since he won the title. The crowd have been dead and were only involved in his match when he was against Cena.

Posted By: Guest#5562 (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 07:37 PM

 
 
"shawn michaels left for 4 years way back when, and we all survived just fine. wrestling lived on. the undertaker has been "suspended" and "injured" so many times these past few years that it's almost like he *is* gone, and we all have been surviving just fine. wrestling lived on."

That's because you knew that they were bound to come back at some time, but c'mon when it's finally over, you can't tell me you won't really miss hearing that gong or hearing the hbk theme or seeing them STILL being able to put on great matches or seeing them do they're signature moves. Wrestling will live on but it won't be the same. Also,I seen in a comment above me that someone said that these two were never that good to begin with....are u kidding me?


Posted By: cj (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 09:52 PM

 
 
The sad thing is your suggested replacements may not last as long as them. Some of them anyways. Batista is around the same age as HBK & Taker. Edge and Kurt Angle have had neck injuries that will shorten their careers. Angle needs to retire himself soon while he can still walk. There are probably guys who could replace them already on the roster, but WWE scripts everything or doesn't give them mic time, so we may never know how good they can be. I just hope another Stonecold or the Rock comes along by then to save WWE from sucktitude.

Posted By: TheDude (Guest)  on August 13, 2008 at 09:57 PM

 
 
"shawn michaels left for 4 years way back when, and we all survived just fine. wrestling lived on. the undertaker has been "suspended" and "injured" so many times these past few years that it's almost like he *is* gone, and we all have been surviving just fine. wrestling lived on."

I don't remember these "suspensions" ur talking about! If ur saying he had been suspended under the wellness policy ur dead wrong. The problem with u "punks" is that u think every guy bigger than CM Punk takes steroids. Some guys r really big. It's called genetics & weight lifting u should try it some time! BTW, He hasn't gotten bigger over the years. He's noticeably lost muscle mass over the years. He doesn't even look like he was built in a pharmacy. Some of u should do research before u talk.

I'm tired of everyone who says he's not talented in the ring either. News flash being big doesn't mean u suck. Taker is better in the ring at the age of 43 than most guys in their 20's in the "E" & that's fact!!! No need 2 be a jackass because ur boy was never pushed & u thought Taker should have put him over. Taker has more talent in his pinky finger than a lot of u jackasses have coursing through ur veins!! Stop attacking the big guys & get a life.

PEACE!


Posted By: THE BOMB! (Guest)  on August 14, 2008 at 10:56 AM

 
 
The next shawn michaels. Watch guys like evan bourne and brian kendrick. Yes they are small but so is michaels. The next undrtaker well that is a tough one.

Posted By: Guest#9829 (Guest)  on August 14, 2008 at 02:24 PM

 
 
I think that bother Edge and Jericho will go down as legends and they both have great ability.

One thing i'd love to see Jericho do is wrestle a match as Shawn Michaels. Do all of Michaels spots as I think Jericho is the equal of Michaels in ability it's just that Michaels is always booked as being resilient and can he do it while Jericho's ability isnt ever really questioned.

Posted By: DaveJuk (Guest) on August 13, 2008 at 10:20 AM

I like Jericho and think he is one of the besat performers in trhe world today, both on the mike and in the ring. But HBK is the best i have ever seen (yes better then Flair). It will be a great loss for the buisness when he retires, wrestling will continue and there will be new stars but you will not see anyone as good as HBK for a long time.


Posted By: Paul (Guest)  on August 14, 2008 at 05:20 PM

 
 
i cant live if hbk retire

Posted By: abeer (Guest)  on August 16, 2008 at 12:58 PM

 
 
Don't worry, Shawn won't retire until I want him to.

Posted By: Triple H (Guest)  on August 17, 2008 at 03:21 AM

 
 
Hey dan, you said in last week's coulumn that you would have a blog on the aftermath of your tna v.s wwe war.Where can i find it

Posted By: jonah (Guest)  on August 19, 2008 at 07:39 AM

 


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